Jude Bellingham (Dortmund)

Oh if you believe that then this discussion is useless. Cheers.

https://sqaf.club/financial-fair-play-which-teams-have-been-punished-ffp/


Multiple clubs been fined for FFP breaches including being banned from European Comps

Deffo mate. Last summer he got the centre half to replace lovren ... who he had to gamble selling so he could buy a left back in tsimikas. That didn't work out too good did it? And in the winter with us on our arse they backed him to the tune of 3m to bring in a championship defender who he didn't want and kabak who he didn't want either.

To bring konate in he had to sell 4 players and he managed to break even again last summer. I think we were 850k in profit past summer.

I'm sure there were other players he wanted to bring in ... but he didn't have enough assets he was happy  to sell to raise funds. So he cobbled together enough for konate to avoid any repeat of last season when he was left short.

This summer origi, minamino and ox may be used to raise penny's for a new player ... milly onto the coaching staff maybe. Maybe he looks at cashing in on mane or Bobby to raise funds with them both having 1 year left and no noise over a new deal for either. There is the possibility Mo doesn't resign ....

I don't see Firmino fetching more than £20m if that. How many other teams need a 9 that doesn't score many? He's good for our system but how many play with our system? Would Barca want him? I doubt it. I can't see many teams wanting him or willing to pay big.

I can't see the club selling Mane.

I reckon this summer we spend £80/85m. Our annual £30m plus the sale of Ox, Minamino, Phillips and Gomez. We can't have four centre backs, of this calibre, in our squad. It's usually three centrebacks of quality and a Phillips type player.

So Gomez, when it's all said and done, will fetch around £30m.

Ox will fetch about £20m. Comes with high wages which limits his move.

Taki will fetch about £15-18m. He's done nothing to show he's increased much from his initial transfer to us.

Phillips is struggling to attract the offer we want, which word is £20m, so I believe we'll lower our demands and he'll fetch about £12-14m.

So that's an extra £80m on top of our annual £30m. Could leave us with £110m to spend BUT this is fsg. They'll tell us about bills, water, gas and leccy has gone up and so on. We'll end up with about £80m.

That gets us one quality midfielder. That's not enough. We need two midfielders and a winger. This is why we've been hearing whispers fsg are looking to go young with the view of the player developing. That doesn't sound to me like shoe in type signings. That sounds like Harvey Elliot type signings.

I don't see Firmino fetching more than £20m if that. How many other teams need a 9 that doesn't score many? He's good for our system but how many play with our system? Would Barca want him? I doubt it. I can't see many teams wanting him or willing to pay big.

I can't see the club selling Mane.

Origi will go in the summer.

As for mane .... this summer is the last chance to get any money for him. He can sign a pre contract elsewhere 11 months from now. No noise over a new deal. You gonna let him go for free?

No way they are renewing salah and Mane and Bobby. If they won't pay the going rate and what Mo deserves then Jürgen needs to sell him and get 100m plus this summer. Maybe then they attempt to keep mane. But Salah is the want Jürgen wants most out of the 3. Bobby is up at the end of next season so like Mo and Sadio this summer is the last chance to get money in for him. Again, like Sadio there is no noise or talks over a new deal .... that we know of.

Bobby needs a change I feel ... and so do we. Love Bob but if we could keep Mo and add a 9 capable of 20 plus a season we would be stronger for it.

That’s not how they run their clubs - they stated that clearly from the start and that hasn’t changed.

Yes we all know … but what’s stopping them from throwing a little bit of cash from the their ‘own’ pockets..?

Yes we all know … but what’s stopping them from throwing a little bit of cash from the their ‘own’ pockets..?

Which pockets ? The clubs is owned by a company with multiple owners and the wealth is mainly in assets as opposed to cash .

Just seen a random twitter post from somebody with absolutely 0 credibility that says we are looking to sign Dybala. I can't wait for the usual gang to lose their sh*t once Dybala signs a new deal at Juventus or goes somewhere else as if we were really in for him and just lacked the funds to finalize it.

Keep on destroying thread after thread gang. Superb job.

Which pockets ? The clubs is owned by a company with multiple owners and the wealth is mainly in assets as opposed to cash .

From their collective pockets…I’m sure our multiple owners can have a whip around & throw some glitter on this team to give it that added sparkle…

Every now & then I dip into my own pockets to buy stock for my store knowing it’s good stock & I’ll recoup money & profit down the line..

It’s that simple..

This all day

Instead of looking at net - look at the players that have been bought

Alisson
Matip
Konate
VVD
Robertson
Fabinho
Thiago
Keita
Oxlade
Elliott
Mane
Mo
Jota
Gini
Shaqiri
Kostas
Gordon

The club have been that good at recruitment they have bought players that won the club the CL and League and right not we are challenging for 4 trophies

Yet it’s always a concentration on spending figures


Does it really matter what the net spend in as long as what money is spent is done getting the right players in


Example - we spent less on Alisson than Kepa , less on VVD than Maguire , less on Jota than Werner , less on Robertson than Shaw

And then add in players coming through like TAA

So is it a case of the right players regardless the amount

If you think net spend is arbitrary, go ahead and think that but the fact is we were only able to beat city to the title the one year they were truly out of sorts and suffering from an injury crisis in a critical area; FFP’s failure has f*%ked us and our way of doing things; sooner or later FSG are going to have to come to terms with changing the plan in light of the fire hose of cash our rivals are aiming at assembling large teams of extremely talented players, building those 60, 70, 80m flops into the cost of doing business.

Origi will go in the summer.

As for mane .... this summer is the last chance to get any money for him. He can sign a pre contract elsewhere 11 months from now. No noise over a new deal. You gonna let him go for free?

No way they are renewing salah and Mane and Bobby. If they won't pay the going rate and what Mo deserves then Jürgen needs to sell him and get 100m plus this summer. Maybe then they attempt to keep mane. But Salah is the want Jürgen wants most out of the 3. Bobby is up at the end of next season so like Mo and Sadio this summer is the last chance to get money in for him. Again, like Sadio there is no noise or talks over a new deal .... that we know of.

Bobby needs a change I feel ... and so do we. Love Bob but if we could keep Mo and add a 9 capable of 20 plus a season we would be stronger for it.

I agree. My point is how much does Firmino fetch?  I say £20 max, if that. He's not compatible with a lot of teams formation. It could be back to Brazil for him.

Does Mane get another contract? If not he needs selling. How much does Mane fetch? Do other teams view him like us?

If we only spend what we make then surely we should have more available than what we’ve seen. I haven’t checked the accounts but I know we made a loss in the previous accounts.

But prior to that we made a profit under FSG every year didn’t we, so where’s that gone? Sat in a bank account making interest somewhere. We have the best manager in the world but we operate on such a lean model, just back him a little more and he’d clean up.

Stadium I assume wasn’t paid for out of the profits the club made, I think that was a loan from the owners so where is the previous profits we’ve made that must have accumulated?

I don’t massively believe in the net spend argument but ffs we shouldn’t be turning a profit every window on transfers, we spend less now than we did under Moores comparatively.

Personally I wouldn’t be against them loaning money to the club and the club paying it back, think H&G put us all off that approach of going into debt but it’s pretty common and it wouldn’t be in debt to the bank it would be to our own owners. And I don’t mean a massive loan either but enough to actually fund some players without having to sell first would be nice.

They’ve got us thinking that renewing a contract is like signing a new player - it’s not, it’s a necessity to remain competitive.

If we only spend what we make then surely we should have more available than what we’ve seen. I haven’t checked the accounts but I know we made a loss in the previous accounts.

But prior to that we made a profit under FSG every year didn’t we, so where’s that gone? Sat in a bank account making interest somewhere. We have the best manager in the world but we operate on such a lean model, just back him a little more and he’d clean up.

Stadium I assume wasn’t paid for out of the profits the club made, I think that was a loan from the owners so where is the previous profits we’ve made that must have accumulated?

I don’t massively believe in the net spend argument but ffs we shouldn’t be turning a profit every window on transfers, we spend less now than we did under Moores comparatively.

Personally I wouldn’t be against them loaning money to the club and the club paying it back, think H&G put us all off that approach of going into debt but it’s pretty common and it wouldn’t be in debt to the bank it would be to our own owners. And I don’t mean a massive loan either but enough to actually fund some players without having to sell first would be nice.

They’ve got us thinking that renewing a contract is like signing a new player - it’s not, it’s a necessity to remain competitive.

Any profits made in a financial year are balanced out by losses the year after - the way the accounts are submitted are a year behind but whenever they get released there is headlines of record revenues etc

But there isn’t piles of profit cash building up interest in the bank somewhere - any profit they did make in any financial year is spent

The loan used to build the main stand is paid back via the club income

I don’t know when we made a profit in the transfer window but in the summer we spent £36mil and brought in £24mil in sales

We have a superb team right now build spending within the clubs means without needing loans or owners personal fortunes , seen enough clubs struggle trying to spend too much.

The current method is working.

If you think net spend is arbitrary, go ahead and think that but the fact is we were only able to beat city to the title the one year they were truly out of sorts and suffering from an injury crisis in a critical area; FFP’s failure has f*%ked us and our way of doing things; sooner or later FSG are going to have to come to terms with changing the plan in light of the fire hose of cash our rivals are aiming at assembling large teams of extremely talented players, building those 60, 70, 80m flops into the cost of doing business.

So we only won the title because City had issues ?! Complete f**king bollocks

We went unbeaten for the first 27 games !! That’s got nothing to do with City - we were that good we had that title wrapped up quicker than any other team in history

Sometimes I think our own fans don’t give the squad enough credit

If we only spend what we make then surely we should have more available than what we’ve seen. I haven’t checked the accounts but I know we made a loss in the previous accounts.

But prior to that we made a profit under FSG every year didn’t we, so where’s that gone? Sat in a bank account making interest somewhere. We have the best manager in the world but we operate on such a lean model, just back him a little more and he’d clean up.

Stadium I assume wasn’t paid for out of the profits the club made, I think that was a loan from the owners so where is the previous profits we’ve made that must have accumulated?

I don’t massively believe in the net spend argument but ffs we shouldn’t be turning a profit every window on transfers, we spend less now than we did under Moores comparatively.

Personally I wouldn’t be against them loaning money to the club and the club paying it back, think H&G put us all off that approach of going into debt but it’s pretty common and it wouldn’t be in debt to the bank it would be to our own owners. And I don’t mean a massive loan either but enough to actually fund some players without having to sell first would be nice.

They’ve got us thinking that renewing a contract is like signing a new player - it’s not, it’s a necessity to remain competitive.

There's no trophies for being debt free. I said before there's nothing wrong with a football team having a debt against it. It can always be repaid over years.

The ffp approach failed but fsg are still living by that OUTDATED model. Yes, it's outdated. Fsg fan boys point to a year and a half ago and aay "look we signed Thiago and Jota". A year and a half ago! It's like me being overweight and getting my photo album out on a date and saying look I was in shape a year and a half ago.

Anyway, let's talk end of the year. Right now we're in a position were the fan boys can say "we're in a final, 2nd and still in the Champions League".

I don't think we'll win two of those three competitions with our midfield so I'll speak to them end of the season and see if they're still talking the same talk.

Instead of looking at net - look at the players that have been bought

Alisson
Matip
Konate
VVD
Robertson
Fabinho
Thiago
Keita
Oxlade
Elliott
Mane
Mo
Jota
Gini
Shaqiri
Kostas
Gordon

The club have been that good at recruitment they have bought players that won the club the CL and League and right not we are challenging for 4 trophies

Yet it’s always a concentration on spending figures


Does it really matter what the net spend in as long as what money is spent is done getting the right players in


Example - we spent less on Alisson than Kepa , less on VVD than Maguire , less on Jota than Werner , less on Robertson than Shaw

And then add in players coming through like TAA

So is it a case of the right players regardless the amount

its been pretty good tbh past 5 years or so. a good blend.

Frees. academy, low fees, middle fees, and a few big money buys.

its been pretty good tbh past 5 years or so. a good blend.

Frees. academy, low fees, middle fees, and a few big money buys.

And all done without taking loans , getting into debt or the owner spending his own money


We can’t spend like some other clubs do - but we have shown with great recruitment that it’s not always about how much

its been pretty good tbh past 5 years or so. a good blend.

Frees. academy, low fees, middle fees, and a few big money buys.

No one doubts the quality of additions - but considering the way our competitors are recruiting and the fact we’re so close to dominating, now is the time to reinforce

No one doubts the quality of additions - but considering the way our competitors are recruiting and the fact we’re so close to dominating, now is the time to reinforce

I'd like to see a fair amount of recruitment this summer - Bellingham would be amazing but any CM we feel is right, plus a young forward like the Carvalho kid at Fulham. With that said, I don't think you can dominate this league for more than one season any more, the competition is too strong. Unless you are City with a bottomless pit of money it's just not feasible, and even City can't dominate every year (as shown by us in 19/20 and even the year before)

Our achievements over those years, to get 98 points and not win, and then to smash the league the next year, are underplayed by everyone from rival fans to our own. It was special, and I don't know when a team will win by such a margin again.

Like it or not, with FSG the best we can hope for is to continue to make our less frequent forays into the market hit as much as we have - it's a huge credit to Klopp and the recruitment team to have built this brilliant team having not spent a whole lot.

Anyway back to Jude - it's obvious to everyone now is the time to pull in some young signings to refresh the squad. We've seen it with Jota and Konate, and personally I would love our next big one to be Bellingham, the kid is a star.

And all done without taking loans , getting into debt or the owner spending his own money


We can’t spend like some other clubs do - but we have shown with great recruitment that it’s not always about how much

very true.

No one doubts the quality of additions - but considering the way our competitors are recruiting and the fact we’re so close to dominating, now is the time to reinforce

well tbh I think we will do quite a lot of business in the summer, as discussed in other threads we have an ageing MF, and klopp and co will know this.

I'd like to see a fair amount of recruitment this summer - Bellingham would be amazing but any CM we feel is right, plus a young forward like the Carvalho kid at Fulham. With that said, I don't think you can dominate this league for more than one season any more, the competition is too strong. Unless you are City with a bottomless pit of money it's just not feasible, and even City can't dominate every year (as shown by us in 19/20 and even the year before)

Our achievements over those years, to get 98 points and not win, and then to smash the league the next year, are underplayed by everyone from rival fans to our own. It was special, and I don't know when a team will win by such a margin again.

Like it or not, with FSG the best we can hope for is to continue to make our less frequent forays into the market hit as much as we have - it's a huge credit to Klopp and the recruitment team to have built this brilliant team having not spent a whole lot.

Anyway back to Jude - it's obvious to everyone now is the time to pull in some young signings to refresh the squad. We've seen it with Jota and Konate, and personally I would love our next big one to be Bellingham, the kid is a star.

yup.

But I actually laugh at how we talk about hundreds of millions of money spent as not very much. Most clubs would love to be in our situation.

One recurrent problematic argument I see being made here is ''love the way we recruit and we've shown you don't need to match City for cash to compete with them BUT we need to spend much more'' (paraphrasing here). It is a paradox. We can't do both things at the same time. We can't recruit smart (which by the way requires a lot of time to find the appropriate targets and then pull the trigger at the right time for your squad) and then spend big money on the side with no real aim. You can spend big money but it has to be smart. We did so with VVD, Alisson and Fab to a certain extent.

I still don't understand what's all the moaning about. The starting 11 hardly has any player you can improve upon without spending nearly 80M+ a pop on one of the 4 or 5 players playing comparable quality (not better) football in the same position at the current time and that could be available. And this is of course if you bypass all the ''good recuitement'' side of things because you're just going for names at that point with no other criteria being used other than ''they are good in whatever team they are at''.

The depth of the squad is a moot debate. We are not going to swap Origi and Minamino for Mahrez and Grealish and we will never do so unless we are bought by some oil country or the club evolves into a huge business entity able to swallow 200 million pounds loans one after the other. Even if the ''owners dipped into their pockets'' we wouldn't have the means to pay such yearly wages for players who are brought in to play anything less than constant starting 11 football.

With that said, we are going to buy players this summer and the next one to refresh the squad. We're going to see a winger who's job will be to take Sadio's place in the medium to long term future. We're also going to see a midfielder. Maybe a right-back to push TAA a bit like Tsimikas is doing with Robbo. All of this will also be supplemented with an academy player or two making the move into a more permanent spot in the squad (Gordon, Morton, Sepp, etc.)

Edit: I also imagine the CB situation will get a look because right now Matip (deal runs until summer 2024) seems to be cememented into the starting role alongside VVD. Gomez will probably want to play more football so will Konate. I can see us selling one of Matip or Gomez (the former is more likely but then again both have had a lot of injury problems) and have a CB team consisting of VVD, GOMEZ/MATIP, KONATE, Sepp and some other name like Rhys or Koumetio eventually.

2ND edit: I'm sorry for mentionning SEPP. I can see the moaning sh*t storm that will fall on us. F**k this dude we bought a few years ago with a clear plan to try and eventually make him into an important part of our squad. If he wasn't bought for 90M then he's sh*te, baby! This or get Sule! We absolutely don't need him but since he's leaving on a free FSG would be stingy shitheads if they didn't get him!!

No one doubts the quality of additions - but considering the way our competitors are recruiting and the fact we’re so close to dominating, now is the time to reinforce

It's like they can't see that the game's changed