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      Q. LFC Man of the Match v Arsenal?

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      19 (24.1%)
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      1 (1.3%)
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      1 (1.3%)
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      Total Members Voted: 79

      Voting closed: Nov 24, 2021 07:21:15 pm

      Liverpool 4-0 Arsenal: In game and Post Match discussion

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      CT_LFC
      • Forum Legend - Fagan
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      Re: Liverpool 4-0 Arsenal: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #375: Nov 22, 2021 03:20:25 pm
      That’s the way it always is in any type of these forums/debates
      Defeats cause more discussion than victories.. defeats spark both sides of a debate
      Victories don’t because everyone simply praises the performance

      Can I ask you a question? Do you think everything is perfect within the balance of the squad? Even with a bigger budget you wouldn’t add anyone else?

      Don’t get me wrong I love this squad and I adore this manager, I have supported the club for over 30 years and at least half this team get in my all time 11.. the manager would lead it. So for the record I adore this time but the question stands

      Nothing is perfect but i think this squad is good enough to win any trophy out there. I don't care about budgets because if a player is good it really doesn't matter to me how much he cost. We paid nothing for Matip and he's as good as there is out there. I also want to give our young academy players an opportunity to make an impact on the team and am glad a few years ago we gave Trent that chance instead of going out and buying Kyle Walker for almost 50M.

      With a team that will need major retooling over the next few years as several key players enter their 30s, it was clear Gini had to go as we could not have Hendo, Thiago and Gini aging at the same time and i am glad Elliott was given the chance to make an impact on the team instead of buying someone and block his path. Morton is looking like he could be a valuable part of the team in the not too distant future, and when that time comes i hope we open up a spot in the squad for him, when, let's say, Milner leaves/retires, which i know will cause a lot of consternation with the usual few because he wouldn't be an expensive addition and therefore we "won't be backing Jürgen".

      With the amount of games players have to play these days between internationals, league and cups you know going in that there will be injuries, but you simply cannot plan for injuries like we've seen to Elliott, Thiago and Van Dijk recently as they have nothing to do with player reliability and it's because of hack jobs that injured them. It could have happened to Gini or anyone else. Luck sometimes just isn't on our side.

      Spend as an indicator of quality, success, or anything, really, is hugely flawed as it ignores the ability of the scouting team to identify players, the ability to negotiate down a transfer in, the ability to negotiate up a transfer out, the role of the academy, coaching, fit within the squad, etc. It is flat out lazy to hang onto that figure as an argument point. Arsenal have spent in excess of 200M (pounds) over the past 3 seasons and we wiped the floor with them yesterday.
      Redman7804
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      Re: Liverpool 4-0 Arsenal: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #376: Nov 22, 2021 03:56:06 pm
      Nothing is perfect but i think this squad is good enough to win any trophy out there. I don't care about budgets because if a player is good it really doesn't matter to me how much he cost. We paid nothing for Matip and he's as good as there is out there. I also want to give our young academy players an opportunity to make an impact on the team and am glad a few years ago we gave Trent that chance instead of going out and buying Kyle Walker for almost 50M.

      With a team that will need major retooling over the next few years as several key players enter their 30s, it was clear Gini had to go as we could not have Hendo, Thiago and Gini aging at the same time and i am glad Elliott was given the chance to make an impact on the team instead of buying someone and block his path. Morton is looking like he could be a valuable part of the team in the not too distant future, and when that time comes i hope we open up a spot in the squad for him, when, let's say, Milner leaves/retires, which i know will cause a lot of consternation with the usual few because he wouldn't be an expensive addition and therefore we "won't be backing Jürgen".

      With the amount of games players have to play these days between internationals, league and cups you know going in that there will be injuries, but you simply cannot plan for injuries like we've seen to Elliott, Thiago and Van Dijk recently as they have nothing to do with player reliability and it's because of hack jobs that injured them. It could have happened to Gini or anyone else. Luck sometimes just isn't on our side.

      Spend as an indicator of quality, success, or anything, really, is hugely flawed as it ignores the ability of the scouting team to identify players, the ability to negotiate down a transfer in, the ability to negotiate up a transfer out, the role of the academy, coaching, fit within the squad, etc. It is flat out lazy to hang onto that figure as an argument point. Arsenal have spent in excess of 200M (pounds) over the past 3 seasons and we wiped the floor with them yesterday.

      You see you can do it, you can add relevant debate without trying to diminish other people’s views
      This adds far more possibility for debate than the unfounded and ridiculous one line barbs about others

      I agree with a lot, if not all you say. I say if not all because for me you’re still trying to try to sneakily throw a few digs out as you make pertinent points

      As to the point of cost of a new player, I don’t think anyone questions the cost personally, or the individual because I think there is trust out there, based on the evidence we see that it doesn’t have to be a player of a certain value to come in, just simply the net spenders, as you call them, are merely asking that if on a net basis only this has been spent then surely there is money to find someone in areas where we may be short

      I don’t see how the two are any different myself, if we had spent more - maybe even only on the face of it - then that argument couldn’t be made, but because we have then it will always be there if we are seemingly short in the odd area

      Because of the fantastic job done by Micheal Edwards, Jürgen and anyone else in the process we don’t need to spend £200m like Arsenal because we aren’t on catch up, we are right up there setting the pace, so again because the net spend is relatively low on the face of it the question is rightly asked at times, surely there is enough around to add that extra one… that extra one that will potentially cement our position at the top and away from Arsenal and the like who are having to spend money to try to catch up
      It’s seems fair enough to ask that, to spend that little more now rather than stand still

      Whether you agree with it or not, it’s valid and can be asked without the debate being attempted to be shut down by simply calling their view point wrong
      That’s what I don’t understand, because all it causes is this round debate that goes nowhere between both sides of that argument which let’s face it if you’re looking at it in a black or white situation, one side of that argument or the other, then you’re both wrong because like any sane debate there are truths and points on both sides

      I 100% agree with you that I want to see young players come through, and I can guarantee you that a talent like Trent wouldn’t ever be looked beyond, not just under Jürgen, in our history we have promoted the best of the talent and Trent is one of those, absolutely he would have been given that chance because locally like many more before him you had heard about his name and told that you need to see this kid, he’s f**king boss
      Tyler Morton, time will tell, but Jürgen likes him, the rest is up to him and a bit of luck


      I have a genuine worry right now that I agree with your point about the age of a few of the players in their prime right now because if we don’t cash in and we let them lose value that we won’t spend to recruit, no chance, so are one or two real game changes going to be sold soon or redevelop the squad? Where does that put me in your boxes ? I’d love to think you’ll debate that rather than dismiss it as a money moaner

      Point I’m making is a personally see a valid side of both arguments and I find it so frustrating when neither can appreciate or accept either sides view when the absolute truth lays somewhere in the middle
      Lallana in Pyjamas
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      Re: Liverpool 4-0 Arsenal: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #377: Nov 22, 2021 04:56:20 pm
      It’s natural for more talking points to appear out of a game where points were dropped - that’s a given

      People get a bit more frustrated, can see more mistakes etc so the discussion will be longer

      I don’t think there are any issues with that

      Imo the issue is when people post after a defeat with suggestions we can’t do this and that and the players aren’t good enough and the world fell apart because we didn’t replace Gini but then don’t post with balance when we have a game that shows a number of those suggestions to be false


      For example our midfield has been crucified on a daily basis  - yet it dominated in Saturday yet a touch of silence from the critics
      waltonl4
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      Re: Liverpool 4-0 Arsenal: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #378: Nov 22, 2021 07:45:18 pm
      just watching "Inside Anfield" and the atmosphere seems a lot louder than it was on SKY . Although Jürgen wasnt happy with the noise or support. definitely worth a watch on Youtube no commentary just crowd noise
      bmck
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      • YNWA
      Re: Liverpool 4-0 Arsenal: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #379: Nov 22, 2021 11:14:24 pm

      Imo the issue is when people post after a defeat with suggestions we can’t do this and that and the players aren’t good enough and the world fell apart because we didn’t replace Gini but then don’t post with balance when we have a game that shows a number of those suggestions to be false

      For example our midfield has been crucified on a daily basis  - yet it dominated in Saturday yet a touch of silence from the critics

      I'll bite on this one.

      I've said on the FSG thread I think FSG should've done more in the summer transferwise, particularly midfield. I think looking at the bench Saturday, we were short there with all the kids on it, but it didn't make a diff on the day, the lads went and got the job done.

      If at the end of the season we win this and that, then I guess that theory will have been proved wrong, that the squad was sufficient, and believe me I'll be as delighted as anyone to be wrong and win some silverware :)

      I notice when people mention things like squad strength after a defeat, they're "crying" - while when others go the other way after a win and say how strong it is, and everything's fine, they have some kind of moral high ground !? Don't really get that - it's just opinions - when we loose there's lots of reasons, if people think squad depth is a problem, fair enough, but that seems to push a some peoples buttons. Actually personally don't think squad depth has really been a problem yet. Maybe it won't be. Thought at WH we lost because we didn't cope at the back with predictable set piece moves from their big lumps.

      We have a really strong core set of players, that will win a lot of football matches. And the best manager in the world. Think our midfield lads have done great so far, and long may it continue.
      lfc across the water
      • Needs a Klopp hug...Rafa's Number 1 fan...VAR has no faults Promoter
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      Re: Liverpool 4-0 Arsenal: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #380: Nov 22, 2021 11:59:44 pm
      Quote from Redman7804
      That’s the way it always is in any type of these forums/debates
      Defeats cause more discussion than victories.. defeats spark both sides of a debate
      Victories don’t because everyone simply praises the performance

      It's so frustrating that all it takes is one negative result, and suddenly match threads are active for a week, usually from the same selection of posters, rehashing the same arguments over and over again. One poster wrote the season off as a top 4 fight, after the last game. He may be right come May, but there are still 78 more points to fight for, we're in a LC quarter final, and while half of Europe is busy working out the permutations on what they need to reach the next round, our European Cup progress is already settled. There are many teams worse off than ours right now.

      After this victory, I put forward a number of suggestions for discussion in my last post. It's great that after all the Gini noise, that we have enough strength in depth in midfield to come in and win this game 4-0, and it's incredible that Trent has got 50 assists for someone in his position. So there are talking points after wins, for those who really want to find them.
      AussieRed
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      • You'll Never Walk Alone
      Re: Liverpool 4-0 Arsenal: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #381: Nov 24, 2021 01:24:39 am
      Yessss Kicked sh*t thru that mob again.

      Could easily have been 7 or 8 if it wasn't for Drysdale

      That Football was just lovely on the eye, to watch.

      Get the f**k innnnnnn
      ruthcity
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      • 5,501 posts | 1034 
      Re: Liverpool 4-0 Arsenal: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #382: Nov 24, 2021 11:03:20 am
      It's so frustrating that all it takes is one negative result, and suddenly match threads are active for a week, usually from the same selection of posters, rehashing the same arguments over and over again.

      It's all about spending money and buying more new players. The pattern is always the same.

      1) We should have replaced Gini.
      2) The drop in quality from the starting 11 is too great.
      3) We should have anticipated injuries now we don't have cover.

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