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      Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion

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      DanMann
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #598: Jan 09, 2023 08:58:17 am
      Yeahhhh it's all salah's fault. Without Salahs goals and Ali this season we'd be with Everton. We'd be near the bottom.

      We'd be lamenting even more how poor vvd has been all season ... how are right back is comfortably one of the worst defenders in the league week in and f*cking week out. Our midfield that produces the square root of FA defensively or offensively would be called even more into question as would our toothless attack (salah aside) . Maybe our complete lack of depth and being a creche for injury prone mediocrity like Jones keita Ox and Melo would be highlighted even more if we were near the bottom.

      As it is ... yeah its all salah's fault and his contract. Let's get rid of him eh and all will be OK.

      Think is, Salah is at fault for a lot. He's not cost us games, but he's not been performing much at all. He's a luxury player. Once in a blue moon he will do something amazing, but generally speaking he's coasting through games and offering very little. On the odd occasion that he does try to run at a player, he seems to lose the ball far more than not. I know we don't have much option going forward, but surely we can try a different formation and strategy.
      gazred
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #599: Jan 09, 2023 09:41:24 am
      Think is, Salah is at fault for a lot. He's not cost us games, but he's not been performing much at all. He's a luxury player. Once in a blue moon he will do something amazing, but generally speaking he's coasting through games and offering very little. On the odd occasion that he does try to run at a player, he seems to lose the ball far more than not. I know we don't have much option going forward, but surely we can try a different formation and strategy.

      I don't think Salah can be blamed for any of the issues. Almost every game he's walking onto the pitch knowing that he is our best (maybe only significant) goal threat. 2 or 3 years ago we could put out a team with 3 or 4 players the opposition was scared of. Right now it's Mo with a bit of help from Nunez. Mo must be feeling the pressure to carry the attack every game. I know he gets paid a ridiculous amount of money but it must be difficult for him.
      Also, the defenders can overload on his side. If we switch the play to the left who gets the ball? Ox, not very scary, or Robbo. I love Robbo but goal scoring is not his number 1 asset.
      Longy-Shops
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #600: Jan 09, 2023 10:26:37 am
      I dont see it. Salah, when its all said and done, is still our best forward despite the team playing the way it is. Matter of fact, after Alisson I'd argue he is our second best player of the season. 23 goal involvements in 26 games played for the club this season. Those are world class numbers. Pinning what we are seeing on one issue, let alone one player, is pure folly. Mo got his contract and despite looking lacklustre, he is delivering and the numbers back that up. Is there even anything of quality being produced for him consistently and he is waisting it in front of goal? He's producing those numbers in a season where the team is so disjointed its hard to even sit there and watch them play for more than a half and he started the season under what seemed to be instructions to stay pinned to the touch line (remember that whole saga?).

      Beyond the never ending ''should we blame all our problems on Salah?'' debate, like I said, we can't look at our forwards and try to pin this on any of them when they regularly scored 2+ goals  a game (miraculously so I would add) for us this season and we still found ways to drop 2 if not all the points in most of the games we played. Any team that regularly requires more than 2 goals to have a chance at winning a game is simply not performing well enough in other areas to even hope to have any success.

      Had they let Salah leave we would have people saying this is ''small club mentality'' and we let out star player go + we would've signed a replacement RW who I can almost guarantee would not be getting anywhere near the numbers Salah is putting up for us this season so far and people would have one more issue to be moaning about and we'd still have the same problem about how the team is completely sleep walking through huge portions of every game + no midfielders to solve our crisis in that area.
      The whole team is underperforming, Salah included. Your point guaranteeing that any replacement for him would not get near his numbers is impossible to know....it's almost a definition of unknowable.
      PolarBearRed
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #601: Jan 09, 2023 12:46:03 pm
      The whole team is underperforming, Salah included. Your point guaranteeing that any replacement for him would not get near his numbers is impossible to know....it's almost a definition of unknowable.
      Can you name me another right winger, in the world, with numbers close to those of Salah in the past few seasons (or even just this season)? Just do the test and see if you don't end up with names from obscure leagues that have no chance of reproducing those numbers in a top 5 league, let alone the PL. Even those with numbers that are somehow close to Mo's and playing in a not so unknown league would have to come here, adapt to what is considered to be the toughest league in the world and then hit the ground running straight into world class numbers. Matter of fact, a replacement right winger not hitting anywhere near Mo's numbers is about the only thing I could've guaranteed before the season started.

      Btw, side note just to say that in terms of goals involvement, we went out and got the only other winger in the world that has similar numbers to Mo, is young and will develop further. That player is Gakpo

      Think is, Salah is at fault for a lot. He's not cost us games, but he's not been performing much at all. He's a luxury player. Once in a blue moon he will do something amazing, but generally speaking he's coasting through games and offering very little. On the odd occasion that he does try to run at a player, he seems to lose the ball far more than not. I know we don't have much option going forward, but surely we can try a different formation and strategy.

      Mo looking lacklustre is about right. Just like the rest of the team. Him coasting through games like some are saying is what forwards do. He delivers the goals and assists and that's what we need. Some people think that every time he has the ball at the edge of the box he is supposed to reproduce that goal he scored against City last year or else he's not earning his salary. He's not a conventional winger who takes the ball near the touchline and then dribbles through to the box. Mo's work is mainly without the ball, in the form of diagonal runs toward goal in behind the defenders. That's his bread and butter. If you want a tricky winger who can dribble and keep the ball, you've got the wrong player. Those types of wingers are a dime a dozen and generally wont give you even a sniff of the numbers Mo produces season after season for us.
      RC9
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #602: Jan 09, 2023 12:50:54 pm
      So Salah isn't blitzing teams by himself like in the past and that's what people want to focus on? As a team we look shocking, why is one player being singled out? Oh because he wanted more money, well since getting more money he is kept doing what he does and score and assist.

      How have we become a fanbase which is begging for one player to drag us through to save face, Salah is not the problem, our defense and midfield are much bigger issues right now. We are playing a system which we do not have the right players for and it is costing us dearly.

      The Wolves game showed us that we do not have any confidence in seeing out or managing games and we have to just hope we score more than the other team, fully acknowledging we will be concerning, Salah scored, so not much else he can do.
      « Last Edit: Jan 09, 2023 12:56:51 pm by RC9 »
      HScRed1
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #603: Jan 09, 2023 12:56:11 pm


      Mo looking lacklustre is about right. Just like the rest of the team. Him coasting through games like some are saying is what forwards do. He delivers the goals and assists and that's what we need. Some people think that every time he has the ball at the edge of the box he is supposed to reproduce that goal he scored against City last year or else he's not earning his salary. He's not a conventional winger who takes the ball near the touchline and then dribbles through to the box. Mo's work is mainly without the ball, in the form of diagonal runs toward goal in behind the defenders. That's his bread and butter. If you want a tricky winger who can dribble and keep the ball, you've got the wrong player. Those types of wingers are a dime a dozen and generally wont give you even a sniff of the numbers Mo produces season after season for us.

      This is the nail on the head with Mo and indeed you can relate to the rest of the team.
      Previously Mo did most of his work in and around the box but this season for some reason the tactics have him hugging the byline.
      Completely negating his strengths get him back closer to the action area and he will produce the goods.

      It’s a tactical change which as I mentioned is having a negative effect on the whole team with the odd way our midfield is set up as well.

      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #604: Jan 09, 2023 01:33:47 pm
      Can you name me another right winger, in the world, with numbers close to those of Salah in the past few seasons (or even just this season)? Just do the test and see if you don't end up with names from obscure leagues that have no chance of reproducing those numbers in a top 5 league, let alone the PL. Even those with numbers that are somehow close to Mo's and playing in a not so unknown league would have to come here, adapt to what is considered to be the toughest league in the world and then hit the ground running straight into world class numbers. Matter of fact, a replacement right winger not hitting anywhere near Mo's numbers is about the only thing I could've guaranteed before the season started.

      Btw, side note just to say that in terms of goals involvement, we went out and got the only other winger in the world that has similar numbers to Mo, is young and will develop further. That player is Gakpo

      Mo looking lacklustre is about right. Just like the rest of the team. Him coasting through games like some are saying is what forwards do. He delivers the goals and assists and that's what we need. Some people think that every time he has the ball at the edge of the box he is supposed to reproduce that goal he scored against City last year or else he's not earning his salary. He's not a conventional winger who takes the ball near the touchline and then dribbles through to the box. Mo's work is mainly without the ball, in the form of diagonal runs toward goal in behind the defenders. That's his bread and butter. If you want a tricky winger who can dribble and keep the ball, you've got the wrong player. Those types of wingers are a dime a dozen and generally wont give you even a sniff of the numbers Mo produces season after season for us.

      Greedy f**ker should of still squared to Nunez though.

      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #605: Jan 09, 2023 01:34:50 pm
      So Salah isn't blitzing teams by himself like in the past and that's what people want to focus on? As a team we look shocking, why is one player being singled out? Oh because he wanted more money, well since getting more money he is kept doing what he does and score and assist.

      How have we become a fanbase which is begging for one player to drag us through to save face, Salah is not the problem, our defense and midfield are much bigger issues right now. We are playing a system which we do not have the right players for and it is costing us dearly.

      The Wolves game showed us that we do not have any confidence in seeing out or managing games and we have to just hope we score more than the other team, fully acknowledging we will be concerning, Salah scored, so not much else he can do.

      Wasn't blitzing anyone on his Todd, was always assisted by Bobby and Sadio!!
      Harrisimo
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #606: Jan 09, 2023 03:47:41 pm
      Not much response on here to Gakpo's debut. Thought he did OK. Bit surprising was the slight lack of intensity or aggression. Showed a few nice touches, kept the ball well. Didn't really stay out wide. Said he had a few "sloppy" moments.

      Scored about 1 in 3 at PSV which for a wide player is good. Prem a lot more intense than the Eredivisie so I hope he gets that and ups the intensity level.
      Don77
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #607: Jan 09, 2023 04:03:01 pm
      Not much response on here to Gakpo's debut. Thought he did OK. Bit surprising was the slight lack of intensity or aggression. Showed a few nice touches, kept the ball well. Didn't really stay out wide. Said he had a few "sloppy" moments.

      Scored about 1 in 3 at PSV which for a wide player is good. Prem a lot more intense than the Eredivisie so I hope he gets that and ups the intensity level.

      Gapko did OK ... nothing more nothing less. Like any new player he will need time. Fitting into a winning team is more straightforward. Fitting into a team like this will be more difficult.

      I wonder if he could play from the right if needed, Cutting in on his left peg. Then Salah more cental.

      Either way we need players up top scoring regular because nobody else does.

      We need Bob, Diogo and Luis back !!!
      LondonRed83
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #608: Jan 09, 2023 04:07:02 pm
      Gapko did OK ... nothing more nothing less. Like any new player he will need time. Fitting into a winning team is more straightforward. Fitting into a team like this will be more difficult.

      I wonder if he could play from the right if needed, Cutting in on his left peg. Then Salah more cental.

      Either way we need players up top scoring regular because nobody else does.

      We need Bob, Diogo and Luis back !!!

      I want to see some attempts outside the box for once and Gakpo seems equipped to do this.
      Tadders
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #609: Jan 09, 2023 04:44:57 pm
      Not much response on here to Gakpo's debut. Thought he did OK. Bit surprising was the slight lack of intensity or aggression. Showed a few nice touches, kept the ball well. Didn't really stay out wide. Said he had a few "sloppy" moments.

      Scored about 1 in 3 at PSV which for a wide player is good. Prem a lot more intense than the Eredivisie so I hope he gets that and ups the intensity level.

      Yeah i forgot about him. Didnt give the opposition a goal which was great.
      Longy-Shops
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #610: Jan 09, 2023 05:58:37 pm
      Can you name me another right winger, in the world, with numbers close to those of Salah in the past few seasons (or even just this season)? Just do the test and see if you don't end up with names from obscure leagues that have no chance of reproducing those numbers in a top 5 league, let alone the PL. Even those with numbers that are somehow close to Mo's and playing in a not so unknown league would have to come here, adapt to what is considered to be the toughest league in the world and then hit the ground running straight into world class numbers. Matter of fact, a replacement right winger not hitting anywhere near Mo's numbers is about the only thing I could've guaranteed before the season started.

      Btw, side note just to say that in terms of goals involvement, we went out and got the only other winger in the world that has similar numbers to Mo, is young and will develop further. That player is Gakpo

      Mo looking lacklustre is about right. Just like the rest of the team. Him coasting through games like some are saying is what forwards do. He delivers the goals and assists and that's what we need. Some people think that every time he has the ball at the edge of the box he is supposed to reproduce that goal he scored against City last year or else he's not earning his salary. He's not a conventional winger who takes the ball near the touchline and then dribbles through to the box. Mo's work is mainly without the ball, in the form of diagonal runs toward goal in behind the defenders. That's his bread and butter. If you want a tricky winger who can dribble and keep the ball, you've got the wrong player. Those types of wingers are a dime a dozen and generally wont give you even a sniff of the numbers Mo produces season after season for us.
      You can say you would have been confident that a replacement player wouldn't be as prolific as Mo, but you can't say you could guarantee it. It is frankly unknowable...in fact as unlikely, or impossible for you to accept, his replacement might have scored 1 more, 10 more, 20 more....or even none at all.
      It's a matter of logical thinking, likelihoods and probabilities are not guarantees ......Anyway he didn't leave, so the conversation is redundant.
      CT_LFC
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #611: Jan 09, 2023 06:05:01 pm
      You can say you would have been confident that a replacement player wouldn't be as prolific as Mo, but you can't say you could guarantee it. It is frankly unknowable...in fact as unlikely, or impossible for you to accept, his replacement might have scored 1 more, 10 more, 20 more....or even none at all.
      It's a matter of logical thinking, likelihoods and probabilities are not guarantees ......Anyway he didn't leave, so the conversation is redundant.

      He didn't, but if i recall, his renewal was only an additional 2 years, so 3 in total of which we're halfway done through the first. Don't imagine he'll get extended past that so in 18 months we'll likely be talking about his replacement.
      Longy-Shops
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #612: Jan 09, 2023 06:07:08 pm
      Gakpo's first outing: Looked exactly like what it was, a new kid at a new place. A bit awkward, shall I go there?...stay here?...will he run there?
      All a little bit New kid starting school about it....Imagine your nerves stepping out in front of a packed Anfield. He did well enough.
      redtiler
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #613: Jan 09, 2023 08:25:25 pm
      Yeahhhh it's all salah's fault. Without Salahs goals and Ali this season we'd be with Everton. We'd be near the bottom.

      We'd be lamenting even more how poor vvd has been all season ... how are right back is comfortably one of the worst defenders in the league week in and f*cking week out. Our midfield that produces the square root of FA defensively or offensively would be called even more into question as would our toothless attack (salah aside) . Maybe our complete lack of depth and being a creche for injury prone mediocrity like Jones keita Ox and Melo would be highlighted even more if we were near the bottom.

      As it is ... yeah its all salah's fault and his contract. Let's get rid of him eh and all will be OK.
      No, its not down to Salah, but lets say, your working next to someone who is earning double what you are, do you think they are better so they deserve this ?. And even if you say we try to 'get rid', who would take him considering his age and current wages
      Don77
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #614: Jan 09, 2023 08:49:47 pm
      No, its not down to Salah, but lets say, your working next to someone who is earning double what you are, do you think they are better so they deserve this ?. And even if you say we try to 'get rid', who would take him considering his age and current wages


      Who would take Salah? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣. My gosh ... let me think. Nobody eh as he's past it now eh. The bs in here is laughable. If we cashed in on Salah there'd be no shortage of takers. He's one of the best in the world, currently stuck in an average team.
      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #615: Jan 09, 2023 09:05:54 pm
      Who would take Salah? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣. My gosh ... let me think. Nobody eh as he's past it now eh. The bs in here is laughable. If we cashed in on Salah there'd be no shortage of takers. He's one of the best in the world, currently stuck in an average team.

      No shortage of takers?

      Now whittle that down to those who could afford the transfer fee and wages

      PSG
      City
      Newcastle
      CT_LFC
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #616: Jan 09, 2023 09:31:57 pm
      No shortage of takers?

      Now whittle that down to those who could afford the transfer fee and wages

      PSG
      City
      Newcastle

      and PSG already have a RW.
      redtiler
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #617: Jan 13, 2023 09:52:16 pm
      No shortage of takers?

      Now whittle that down to those who could afford the transfer fee and wages

      PSG
      City
      Newcastle

      How much would they have to pay Lpool for him?
      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Wolves: In game and post match discussion
      Reply #618: Jan 13, 2023 09:55:29 pm
      How much would they have to pay Lpool for him?

      Well take into account extended contract.

      Would be a fair few million.

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