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      Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?

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      Longy-Shops
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      Re: Premier League clubs to vote on scrapping VAR
      Reply #115: Jun 09, 2024 01:01:07 pm
      The league has announced six areas in which it hopes to improve VAR performance after a season when the average delay in decision making increased by more than 50%.

      The biggest initiative will be the adoption of semi-automated offside technology after the autumn international break. It will use dedicated in-stadium cameras to calculate the position of a receiving player when a pass is played and end the need to draw lines to determine offsides. It has been predicted to reduce the average time taken to calculate an offside decision by more than half a minute.


      Other changes largely relate to communication. From next season, referees will be able to announce the reason for a VAR overturn, providing a small improvement in the stadium experience for fans. The league says it also hopes to provide ā€œan enhanced offering of big-screen replays to include all VAR interventionsā€.


      There will also be increased communication through the media, including the established Match Officials Micā€™d Up broadcast when the head of PGMOL, Howard Webb, talks through the most controversial decisions. A public communication plan is also promised to ā€œfurther clarify VARā€™s role in the game to participants and supportersā€. Plans to improve training in VAR for match officials will also continue.

      The leagueā€™s six proposals have been anticipated and there will be expectation that they deliver an upturn in the performance of a Ā­system that is increasingly Ā­frustrating clubs and spectators.
      It's like giving a clapped out car a respray....it'll look good for a bit but it's still not fit for purpose.
      Harrisimo
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      Re: Premier League clubs to vote on scrapping VAR
      Reply #116: Jun 09, 2024 01:04:20 pm
      The league has announced six areas in which it hopes to improve VAR performance after a season when the average delay in decision making increased by more than 50%.

      The biggest initiative will be the adoption of semi-automated offside technology after the autumn international break. It will use dedicated in-stadium cameras to calculate the position of a receiving player when a pass is played and end the need to draw lines to determine offsides. It has been predicted to reduce the average time taken to calculate an offside decision by more than half a minute.


      Other changes largely relate to communication. From next season, referees will be able to announce the reason for a VAR overturn, providing a small improvement in the stadium experience for fans. The league says it also hopes to provide ā€œan enhanced offering of big-screen replays to include all VAR interventionsā€.


      There will also be increased communication through the media, including the established Match Officials Micā€™d Up broadcast when the head of PGMOL, Howard Webb, talks through the most controversial decisions. A public communication plan is also promised to ā€œfurther clarify VARā€™s role in the game to participants and supportersā€. Plans to improve training in VAR for match officials will also continue.

      The leagueā€™s six proposals have been anticipated and there will be expectation that they deliver an upturn in the performance of a Ā­system that is increasingly Ā­frustrating clubs and spectators.

      Thanks for the update VR. We'll have to wait and see if it improves the system. But a bad decision is a bad decision no matter how they dress it up. "Reason for a VAR overturn"..well should be more of why a decision was not reviewed using pitch side monitor. Minor refinements, yeah might improve the decision making process. Won't hold my breath though.
      Harrisimo
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      Re: Premier League clubs to vote on scrapping VAR
      Reply #117: Jun 09, 2024 01:10:32 pm
      Seeing as we are keeping VAR there's no obvious reason to not trail your idea of Captains (3) challenges and see how it plays out. In the long run I can't imagine it would make a lot of difference....The three examples you give would have been checked. As for the difficulty of faking a penalty....well how many times have you seen Harry Kane throw his foot into a defender or keeper?

      Maybe they looked at it and thought it wouldn't improve the system. But my view is it would redress some of the perceived unfairness and the outlandish corruption theories. Also the teams down the lower end always seems to get a raw deal against the top teams, especially the London clubs and the Mancheater clubs.
      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Premier League clubs to vote on scrapping VAR
      Reply #118: Jun 09, 2024 01:58:30 pm
      They have been saying refs going to be mic-ed up

      If it happened the same way as Rugby or cricket giving ref control then fine. For instance the match official in Rugby and cricket request the coverage on the screen, watch and then make  decision, they don't have stills showing the incident on the screen as the match official appeoaches unlike football and VAR do.

      We're still light years behind other sports in how they use the video review system.
      lfc across the water
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #119: Jun 24, 2024 08:10:49 pm
      Quote from HUYTON RED
      If it happened the same way as Rugby or cricket giving ref control then fine. For instance the match official in Rugby and cricket request the coverage on the screen, watch and then make  decision, they don't have stills showing the incident on the screen as the match official appeoaches unlike football and VAR do.

      We're still light years behind other sports in how they use the video review system.

      You've never seen a cricket review then.

      "Run it through...roll it forward...reverse a frame...is the bat grounded...is the toenail behind the line...is there a heel behind the line...is there a better angle...what other angles have you got?..." All in super slow mo. No complaints whatsoever from anyone about the time taken.

      30 second delay during a season defining review with implications at both ends of the table = Time to start chanting, booing and whistling......

      Quote from shawspeed
      Why should they get credit for doing their paid job correctly? Surely it's what they should be doing consistently week in week out.

      Why should players be worshipped for scoring penalties, winning tackles, saving shots, clearing the ball off the line etc, when they're only doing their job correctly?

      Why should managers be worshipped for making subs, and changing tactics, and managing games, when they're only doing their job correctly?

      Why should teams have parades after winning trophies, when they're only doing the job they're expected to do?

      Why should the health service be praised for saving someone's life, when they're only doing the job they do week in week out?
      lfc across the water
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      Re: Premier League clubs to vote on scrapping VAR
      Reply #120: Jun 24, 2024 08:11:09 pm
      Quote from Harrisimo
      Well you want the match officials to have a say but not the captains. I'm not in any way against keeping VAR. Obviously it has corrected errors but it still leaves blatant errors by the match officials and the VAR team in the clear to carry on. Giving the captains appeals takes away any sense of unfairness.

      I wasn't at all surprised by the margin. But their time would've better spent looking at ways to improve the system and giving the captains some sort of appeal could've been debated. Impossible to find a perfect system but why the clubs are excluded from appeal is a nonsense.

      VAR is about refereeing a match, therefore only their opinion counts. Even with all the negative propaganda that's spewed about VAR on a daily basis, on every possible outlet, the rebels still couldn't even muster enough support from one other club to support them. Another demonstration that VAR works, and is an invaluable addition to the highest level of the game, so that teams only get what they're supposed to get.

      I wasn't surprised about the margin either, I'm just annoyed there was the need for a vote. You don't see referees voting on how clubs are run, but clubs are given the privilege to vote on issues that affect referees. ???
      waltonl4
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #121: Jun 26, 2024 09:46:10 am
      Wonder if Scotland would vote to keep VAR after that blatant penalty miss.
      VAR is a piece of technology the weakness is the entire body of refs don't seem to understand the game and interpret rules blindly
      redno7
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #122: Jun 26, 2024 11:23:37 am
      I think VAR and the AI offsides or whatever they're calling it has worked quite well in the Euros. I mean Scotland got done over like but on the whole it's sped the game up and intervenes less.
      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #123: Jun 26, 2024 12:56:07 pm
      I think VAR and the AI offsides or whatever they're calling it has worked quite well in the Euros. I mean Scotland got done over like but on the whole it's sped the game up and intervenes less.

      If VAR was handled like it is handled by UEFA it wouldn't be an issue. It's just the PGMOL and the "British Empire"way of thinking that our way must be better than everyone else and Uefa know F**k all compared to PGMOL. If it had followed Uefa's process of VAR I honestly don't think there would be this amount of hatred to the system.

      And this is what surprises me with Across The Water and his complete support of the PGMOL!!
      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #124: Jun 26, 2024 12:58:35 pm
      You've never seen a cricket review then.

      Are you trying to compre the process followed by PGMOL is the very F***ing same as that on the cricket.

      F**k off dickhead. Cricket and Rugby are light years ahead of the British Empire tw*ts at the PGMOL ;)
      Harrisimo
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #125: Jun 27, 2024 10:54:47 am
      That's the 23/24 VAR record. We ended up where we started, but I don't think they count the claims we made and the ref just overruled them. What constitutes an official VAR decision. The blatant pen by Doku wasn't  included nor was the Odegaard 'handball. Anyway, just warming up for more massive VAR moans next season

      https://www.espn.co.uk/football/story/_/id/38196464/how-var-decisions-affect-premier-league-club-2023-24

      No wonder Wolves had a whinge..

      .
      « Last Edit: Jun 27, 2024 11:00:43 am by Harrisimo »
      ToshackKeeganOneNil
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #126: Jun 27, 2024 05:37:58 pm
      "Insanity Is Doing the Same Thing (using the same useless idiots as VAR) Over and Over Again and Expecting Different Results" 

      Tweak the software all you want but having an idiot like Coote or any of the others operating it will not make it better.  :mad:
      GERNS
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #127: Jun 27, 2024 10:34:36 pm
      VAR is about refereeing a match, therefore only their opinion counts. Even with all the negative propaganda that's spewed about VAR on a daily basis, on every possible outlet, the rebels still couldn't even muster enough support from one other club to support them. Another demonstration that VAR works, and is an invaluable addition to the highest level of the game, so that teams only get what they're supposed to get.

      I wasn't surprised about the margin either, I'm just annoyed there was the need for a vote. You don't see referees voting on how clubs are run, but clubs are given the privilege to vote on issues that affect referees. ???

      With the way clubs are run, it has little if any impact on referees ?  The way PGMOL is run, certainly gives referees an opportunity to have a massive impact on clubs.  We were robbed of at least 6 points last season, possibly 9 !
      lfc across the water
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #128: Jul 03, 2024 09:17:57 pm
      Quote from HUYTON RED
      If VAR was handled like it is handled by UEFA it wouldn't be an issue. It's just the PGMOL and the "British Empire"way of thinking that our way must be better than everyone else and Uefa know F**k all compared to PGMOL. If it had followed Uefa's process of VAR I honestly don't think there would be this amount of hatred to the system.

      And this is what surprises me with Across The Water and his complete support of the PGMOL!!

      I'm surprised that there is a suggestion of complete support of the PGMOL, whatever that's supposed to mean.

      I'm surprised even more to be told that it has something to do with the British Empire.

      UEFA don't have a process for VAR. The rulebook is laid down by IFAB, and UEFA follow the rulebook. EPL games are refereed in much the same way. Most decisions are correct by the letter of the law, many subjective decisions could go either way, and there's the rare indefensible howler. When the howler happens in Europe, it's usually debated for a few minutes and quietly forgotten about the day after. When it's our league, we call for replays and different officials, if the one chosen loves within a hundred mile radius of the opposition's ground.
      « Last Edit: Jul 04, 2024 02:30:15 pm by lfc across the water »
      GERNS
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #129: Jul 03, 2024 10:48:31 pm
      I hate to say it, but wondering if AI would perform any better than the PGMOL personel, as it wouldn't have any emotional ties to any clubs.
      Feed the info in, and unleash the beast !
      Longy-Shops
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #130: Jul 03, 2024 11:34:53 pm
      I hate to say it, but wondering if AI would perform any better than the PGMOL personel, as it wouldn't have any emotional ties to any clubs.
      Feed the info in, and unleash the beast !
      It would get rid of bias, both unintentional and intentional. All conscious human beings are subject to bias, it is an intrinsic part of the human condition; so much so there are theories that human beings cannot fathom objective reality at all, as all thought/understanding has bias built in, and therefore all our thoughts are subjective. The main problem with your suggestion stems from the AI program mining enough correct data via machine learning....there won't (as yet) be enough examples of indisputable correct football decisions for the software to create the perfect algorithm.....As I say, as yet.
      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #131: Jul 05, 2024 07:18:17 pm
      I'm surprised that there is a suggestion of complete support of the PGMOL, whatever that's supposed to mean.

      I'm surprised even more to be told that it has something to do with the British Empire.


      Then stop acting like a bad dickhead!!
      sore monad
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #132: Jul 11, 2024 01:18:29 pm
      After that ridiculous pen last for England, raises again the question of whether VAR is even improving the decision making results that are supposed to justify its effects on the flow of the game.

      It also seems to be taking us further towards the game being a non contact sport.
      billythered
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #133: Jul 11, 2024 01:37:44 pm
      After that ridiculous pen last for England, raises again the question of whether VAR is even improving the decision making results that are supposed to justify its effects on the flow of the game.

      It also seems to be taking us further towards the game being a non contact sport.




      It was a ridiculous decision everyone can see that, but Iā€™m leaning towards how decisions are influencing results, ask yourself what the more attractive final would beā€¦.Spain Vs Holland, or Spain Vs Englandā€¦.some helping hand curtesy of the VAR box obviously affected the outcome, now say Ollie didnā€™t score that brilliant goalā€¦.whoā€™s to say another dodgy VAR box decision would have been invented to bring about the ā€˜Dreamā€™ finale??


      YNWA
      tytusgroan
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #134: Jul 11, 2024 03:46:08 pm
      Since being an avid follower of football and Liverpool for about 60 years, since this var sh*te has been brought in my appetite for the great game is sinking rapid, last night just added another nail in the coffin for me. It's getting more ridiculous every passing month. Of course being from Jockland hasn't helped the mood this morning.

                             
      billythered
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #135: Jul 12, 2024 11:02:26 am
      Since being an avid follower of football and Liverpool for about 60 years, since this var sh*te has been brought in my appetite for the great game is sinking rapid, last night just added another nail in the coffin for me. It's getting more ridiculous every passing month. Of course being from Jockland hasn't helped the mood this morning.

                             




      Iā€™m with ye laddie, my love for the beautiful game has diminished quite a bit, especially with VAR but more in particular because the ticking of the diversity boxes that allow uneducated bints to voice their futile opinions on a sport that they had berely reached pub team levels yet can offer their expert opinions on a international level,

      Thatā€™s like you or i becoming an expert on womenā€™s make up or fashion and how to insert a f***in tampon correctly , you donā€™t see many men commentating on netball do ye??


      YNWA
      tytusgroan
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #136: Jul 12, 2024 01:03:32 pm
      Diversity another huge call in why the games fu**ed. All these wummin have appeared from nowhere to stamp their infinite knowledge on our game. Give it a rest FFS.
      Longy-Shops
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      Re: Premier League Votes on Scrapping VAR: Saving Football from Ruin?
      Reply #137: Jul 12, 2024 01:11:30 pm
      Diversity another huge call in why the games fu**ed. All these wummin have appeared from nowhere to stamp their infinite knowledge on our game. Give it a rest FFS.
      Bit weird.

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