Target practice

We need fu**ing lots of it. We pissed on Atletico same as we did Spurs and just cant finish. How many chances had we? how many did we need? As with last Wednesday it took a peno, a dubious one, to get a result. Were dominating games but making things hard for ourselves.

We should have absolutely buried both sides. Even Stevie missed a sitter after some good play in the final 3rd from him and Keane.

Without Torres, we've struggled in front of goal, no question about that. Although it's not just shot accuracy, some players seem to lack the composure and they lose themselves when they are in a position to score.

Without Torres, we've struggled in front of goal, no question about that. Although it's not just shot accuracy, some players seem to lack the composure and they lose themselves when they are in a position to score.

i also think a hefty slice of bad luck in the last couple of games, but there is deffo a case for them shitting it at the last moment. a case of lack of composure under pressure, especially keane, but there is others to blame last 2 games ...alonso agger, maybe we need chill pills more than barn door practice

We need fu**ing lots of it. We pissed on Atletico same as we did Spurs and just cant finish. How many chances had we? how many did we need? As with last Wednesday it took a peno, a dubious one, to get a result. Were dominating games but making things hard for ourselves.

We should of buried Spurs and Athletico Madrid with the chances we had,Some team has got to get a hiding one of these days,the quicker the better or we will all finish up with heart problems,mind you that could solve the ticket problems

Torres is the only finisher in the side.

I think Benitez is an excellent defensive coach but I think we are struggling with our attacking play.

Torres is the only finisher in the side.

I think Benitez is an excellent defensive coach but I think we are struggling with our attacking play.

You hinting something there JD?

We need to go out and threatened teams. One of our counter attacks almost went horribly wrong last night. We lost the ball at their goal box and had very little men at the back

Torres is the only finisher in the side.

I think Benitez is an excellent defensive coach but I think we are struggling with our attacking play.

Sorry, JD, don't buy that. Yes, Rafa is an excellent defensive coach, but that provides the platform to attack. We have been excellent going forward in recent games, but in the last two we've missed chances, and at times the final ball was admittedly dodgy, but no one delivers perfectly from every cross or cunning pass, particularly against massed ranks. The approach play was fine, but all players miss chances - Torres had those games against Newcastle and Man City last season, but on other days he bagged hat-tricks.  He didn't need target practice, just confidence on the day.

When we've had to score goals this season to get points, more often than not we have.

You can do all the target practice you want, but in the pressure of a game, it's totally different. In training, I'm sure Agger would have bagged a hat-trick with those chances. For the first one, the defender was all over him, which caused him to miss, and that can't be replicated very easily in shooting sessions.

Robbie Keane is a finisher. He is nearing 200 career goals. He is no less prolific than Wayne Rooney. For Liverpool he is not yet a goalscorer, but that will come.

Steven Gerrard is a finisher. Over 100 goals from midfield, and under Rafa he is averaging 18 a season, having averaged 6 under Houllier. Last night his finishing, bar the penalty, was about as bad as you'll see from him - normally he'd score a couple from those chances.

And from wide midfield, Kuyt's goalscoring record is impressive. Ryan Babel is also capable of scoring goals.

You have games where you miss lots of chances - all teams do. Then, all of a sudden, they'll start flowing in.

Hurry up Torres get back fit we need a finisher.

Can't wait til Torres gets back and playing at his best.

I doubt we will be having many problems after that, we have missed our main striker.

I think the problem rests with Keane. A TV pundit said he is a slow starter, well someone is taking the p!ss. Either he is struggleing to adapt to our type of play, or Liverpool are not playing to his "strenghths" either way after around 20 games and countless training sessions something should be happening, and well, it is not.
If and when it does, then happy days, but until Torres is back, I think we will be struggling to win matches by the margin our play suggests we should win by.

Some tough love is what Robbie needs. No more fairtytale moment for him and time to prove what he is here for.

As for Torres the only finisher, i cannot agree. Surely Stevie knows how to finish, Dirk of late, Babel knows where the back of the net is and Riera likes to come in sometimes to have a sniff.

I agree with you. He hasnt lived up to expectations. He isnt good enough IMO.

I agree with you. He hasnt lived up to expectations. He isnt good enough IMO.

I'm not a backer of him being here for the purpose he is meant to serve but to say he isnt good enough is a bit barbaric. He is good enough, we just cant accomodate him. He has a bagloads of goals, a proven goalscorer and a Red meaning he is obviously good enough if you take into consideraton his individual statistics and skills but it hasnt clicked for him here. On the face of it, he looked to be perfect for Nando but when you look into it and listen to Nando himself, he just doesnt want a partner up top. Kuyt takes up so much space and frees Nando alot but Keane came in to do the same thing as Kuyt when it wasnt an area we needed covering.

The most worrying thing besides his goal rate is, we will lose a lot money on him IF this run continues.

I didn't mean he isn't a good enough player, i just meant he isnt a good enough player to be relied on to be a leading goalscorer. We have lost money on him already. It needs serious thinking about.

Sorry, JD, don't buy that. Yes, Rafa is an excellent defensive coach, but that provides the platform to attack. We have been excellent going forward in recent games, but in the last two we've missed chances, and at times the final ball was admittedly dodgy, but no one delivers perfectly from every cross or cunning pass, particularly against massed ranks. The approach play was fine, but all players miss chances - Torres had those games against Newcastle and Man City last season, but on other days he bagged hat-tricks.  He didn't need target practice, just confidence on the day.

When we've had to score goals this season to get points, more often than not we have.

You can do all the target practice you want, but in the pressure of a game, it's totally different. In training, I'm sure Agger would have bagged a hat-trick with those chances. For the first one, the defender was all over him, which caused him to miss, and that can't be replicated very easily in shooting sessions.

Robbie Keane is a finisher. He is nearing 200 career goals. He is no less prolific than Wayne Rooney. For Liverpool he is not yet a goalscorer, but that will come.

Steven Gerrard is a finisher. Over 100 goals from midfield, and under Rafa he is averaging 18 a season, having averaged 6 under Houllier. Last night his finishing, bar the penalty, was about as bad as you'll see from him - normally he'd score a couple from those chances.

And from wide midfield, Kuyt's goalscoring record is impressive. Ryan Babel is also capable of scoring goals.

You have games where you miss lots of chances - all teams do. Then, all of a sudden, they'll start flowing in.

totally agree,we have been playing well just really unlucky..at the start of the season we didn't play well and won, also its way to early to write of Keane, he needs to adapt it was the same with crouch, you don't just forget how to score.

you don't just forget how to score.

Well lets be honest, Benitez' record in terms of forwards hasn't be great.

His first season included the Euro 2004 top goalscorer (Baros), one of the most wanted French forwards in football (Cisse), one of the most talented youngsters in world football (Pongolle) and come January he bought one of the finest forwards in modern football (Morientes) yet all four really struggled in front of goal for Liverpool, in fact only Baros made double figures in terms of goals that season out of our forwards, scorin 13. He also had Mellor but he rarely got a game.

The followin season he brought in a lad whose goals almost kept the Saints up single handedly (Crouch) along with Cisse and Morientes yet again goals didn't exactly flow from our front men. Cisse's 19 goals wasn't bad, Crouch's 13 goals wasn't a bad total after his poor start but Morientes again failed to make double figures. Fowler was also there, but like Mellor the year before, chances were limited for God.

So two years after Benitez' arrival his two top goalscorin forwards (Baros and Cisse) were no longer at the club. IThird season, we brought in a lad who'd just scored 20+ goals for Blackburn (Bellamy) and a 20 goal a season forward from Holland (Kuyt) to partner Crouch and Fowler up front. Crouch 18, wasn't a bad return, Kuyt got 14 for a first season wasn't the worse. Fowler still scored 7 goals in his few appearances but Bellamy managed just 9 in over 40 appearances.

Last season was the first time a forward scored more than 20 goals under Benitez and that was the finest forward on the planet (Torres). Kuyt's total was less than his first season, Crouch in a stop start season managed only 11 and Ryan Babel also only managed 10 goals.

This season so far we've seen Kuyt return to some goalscorin form, Babel with one (I think) Torres out every other week injured and Keane just lost at sea in front of goal. Maybe our forwards under Benitez do "forget" how to score. In four years, to have only one forward score over 20 goals (in all compititons) is a pretty shambolic record in my opinion.

May I just point out that we've won two trophies(well 3 with Community Shield) despite the lack of goal scorers, granted, out of the 6 goals in those two finals, only one was from a striker(Cisse).

To be fair, Keane has been played as a loan striker in most games since Torres was injured and we all know that he needs a strike partner. So we havent been playing to his strengths. There has been many occasions where Robbie has been in great positions to score and other players for that matter and the final ball is just not good enough. As a team, the main aim is to get the ball to the most natural finisher in the final third but that has not been happening lately

Classes in finishing to be held by Alvaro Arbeloa 

Classes in finishing to be held by Alvaro Arbeloa 

Mr. Arbeloa to you.

Well lets be honest, Benitez' record in terms of forwards hasn't be great.

His first season included the Euro 2004 top goalscorer (Baros), one of the most wanted French forwards in football (Cisse), one of the most talented youngsters in world football (Pongolle) and come January he bought one of the finest forwards in modern football (Morientes) yet all four really struggled in front of goal for Liverpool, in fact only Baros made double figures in terms of goals that season out of our forwards, scorin 13. He also had Mellor but he rarely got a game.

The followin season he brought in a lad whose goals almost kept the Saints up single handedly (Crouch) along with Cisse and Morientes yet again goals didn't exactly flow from our front men. Cisse's 19 goals wasn't bad, Crouch's 13 goals wasn't a bad total after his poor start but Morientes again failed to make double figures. Fowler was also there, but like Mellor the year before, chances were limited for God.

So two years after Benitez' arrival his two top goalscorin forwards (Baros and Cisse) were no longer at the club. IThird season, we brought in a lad who'd just scored 20+ goals for Blackburn (Bellamy) and a 20 goal a season forward from Holland (Kuyt) to partner Crouch and Fowler up front. Crouch 18, wasn't a bad return, Kuyt got 14 for a first season wasn't the worse. Fowler still scored 7 goals in his few appearances but Bellamy managed just 9 in over 40 appearances.

Last season was the first time a forward scored more than 20 goals under Benitez and that was the finest forward on the planet (Torres). Kuyt's total was less than his first season, Crouch in a stop start season managed only 11 and Ryan Babel also only managed 10 goals.

This season so far we've seen Kuyt return to some goalscorin form, Babel with one (I think) Torres out every other week injured and Keane just lost at sea in front of goal. Maybe our forwards under Benitez do "forget" how to score. In four years, to have only one forward score over 20 goals (in all compititons) is a pretty shambolic record in my opinion.

until we bought Torres, i haven't really had much faith in our forwards... i hoped Bellamy would of been better, he just didn't cut it... Cisse had a great attitude and loved the club, he was very unfortunate with his injuries and i do like the guy, but he wasn't consistent enough.. he could be brilliant and rubbish in the same game and it often frustrated me, not on Keane's level at all. Morientes didn't have the pace for the premiership, Baros head down and run, his first touch wasn't great he could be very greedy too... i would like to point out Bellamy and morientes were probably not Rafa's first choice, i understand he didn't get a choice with Cisse either, Baros was already there, mellor lacked pace... Pongolle one of the most promising talents in world football? the french league isn't on level with the premiership... i thought Kuyt would score more but again the dutch league isn't on level with England i do rate him though.. i honestly think only Fernando and Robbie have been Rafas first choice strikers,the cash or players haven't been available, so for what he has achieved with the likes of Baros,Cisse,Pongolle,Kuyt is excellent...

so Dunlop although your post had some good stats in it you obviously like a good bit of research.... apart from God and Morientes in their day, Robbie Keane and Fernando Torres are in a different league to the other forwards mentioned... so as i was referring to Keane and the bashing hes been getting,I'll say again, you don't just forget how to score!