The lack of creativity from our engine room.

I remember Poulsen passing backwards... Lucas being fouled twice... erm... I remember wondering where they were half the time... oh and on 88 minutes, Poulsen actually chipped a good ball FORWARDS to Gerrard!!!  Aside from that, they were woeful.

I am going to kill myself if i ever have to watch that style of negative, defensive football again!
Although saying that- we always seem to pull our fingers out against the big teams (and before anyone says it man-city are yet to be considered a big team!)
So for some strange reason i am not too worried about facing ManU, with Joey Cole back, i am thinking we will see either Poulsen OR Lucas!

If we start to play Gerrard, Meireles and Cole as our 3 central midfielders, we would quite possible have the best midfield in the League.

If we continue with playing Lucas and Poulsen together we will struggle to finish top 8, drop Stevie back there along with hopefully Meireles and we can finish top 4!

I cannot remember a worse centre midfield pairing in 25 years supporting this club!!

It looks messy at the moment,but we will improve,with Gerrard Cole and Meirierls playing,think we will be more creative.Get more balls to Torres.Would like to see Babel giving a run out beside Torres,bit of pace up front.Nando looks bolloxed running around up front on his own.

Hopefully the Poulsen/Lucas pairing is only temporary until Joe comes back from suspension and Raul beds into the side. Once those two are in the side together i predict big things.

Lucas will still feature a lot though i'm certain.

Should definitely be discussed today.  8 shots - 2 goals (both set pieces) and 6 off target.  We created more against Birmingham, a game in which we, as a team, were far worse, vs Birmingham, 18 shots, 3 on target, 7 off & 8 blocked.  We created nothing through the more (ahem) adventurous centre midfield partnership today. 

Meirles and Stevie should be our midfield and we would have no problems

Raul and Stevie in the middle with Joey and Nando ahead of them would give us a far more creative team. That makes a good spine to build around

I agree it was fairly evident again today, however going to Old Trafford, more often than not you expect chances to be few and far between as you expect to be on the back foot for periods in the game.

Thats not making excuses it's stating the obvious, however what I will say is I'm not so sure if it was the players we played or the tactics we used today as in the first half we were diabolical and it took two goals to get us to come back into the game and start pushing United back into their own half, then when we got on level terms it looked like Roy was happy with a point and made his changes which made us revert back to giving United time & space and allowing them to come onto us.

One thing of note is I believe Roy set up giving too much respect to United, we did not close them down instead we retreated and put no pressure on the ball what so ever which is stark in contrast to how Rafa set us up as we always seemed to work hard off the ball closing down the opposition.

But I agree with the posters stating Meirles and Gerrard should be our central midfield pairing when fit.

would you say its the managers fault with the style of play we use that our midfielders are not getting assists. it seems, and as Agger said today, its more hoofball from the back and run onto it and then lay it off so most assists are coming from the strikers?

Okay, Roy Hodgson has been in charge for 12 games already. Five wins in Europe, one win, three draws and two losses in the league, and one draw in the Carling Cup, loss on penalties. Throughout all the matches I've seen so far, I have to say our best performances have come against Steaua Bucharest (2nd half), last 15 minutes against Birmingham City and the last 30 minutes against Sunderland.

The reason for this? In my opinion, it's the central midfield pairing. And I'll try to explain for each game.

Against Steaua Bucharest, we started the first half well with a goal coming in 25 seconds from our new No. 10, Joe Cole. A lapse of concentration by Spearing and Meireles and subsequently Kyrgiakos enabled Steaua to  equalise in the 13th minute and after that, we couldn't do alot because Steaua passed the ball very well and only restricted us to a couple of long range effords. Come the second half, we were very threatening and deserved to win 4-1 at the end.

At St. Andrews, we were kept in the game by a brilliant Pepe Reina. Hardly threatened Ben Foster with the team that started. 15 minutes left, came on Raul Meireles for his Premier League debut to replace Lucas, and once again, we showed attacking football but there was just not enough time to win it.

Trailing 1-2 to Sunderland at home, Poulsen gets taken off in the 62nd minute and Gerrard equalises in the 64th minute. We then went on to look like a top four team by attacking the Sunderland goal like crazy but just couldn't net in the winner.

In the other games and at the start of 2 of the 3 of these games above, a very negative team was set out, I.E. Lucas or/and Poulsen starting in midfield. IMO, they are simply not good enough if we want to be penetrative and threatening because they don't offer much, if not nothing at all, in attack.

Steven Gerrard and Raul Meireles, should always be our central pairing when fit because Gerrard has vision, a passing range and the creativity and Meireles is a more attacking player. I'm not saying we shouldn't play any defensive midfielders but I think it's much better if we put our best and most attacking team, get the goals, kill the game off early and then bring on defensive covers to protect the scoreline if we are leading comfortably to avoid having to put ourselves in a position where we need to chase the game in the last quarter.

If you ask me, Lucas and Poulsen are, in my eyes, defensive midfielders because they way they play clearly shows it. That odd tackle here and there, ground passes sideways and most of the time backwards and that's simply not good enough if we want to score goals. The Lucas and Mascherano pairing showed last season that, that doesn't work effectively and it's just utter nonsense if it's going to be done again this season.

There was a time when you would have to be a footballer first and foremost to play for Liverpool so much so that you can look back 40 years and some of those players would still be able to play. anyone fancy full back pairing of chris Lawler and Phil neal they would probably get 15 -20 goals between them.How about Peter Thompson and Cally on the wings.Ah well if only.

In the other games and at the start of 2 of the 3 of these games above, a very negative team was set out, I.E. Lucas or/and Poulsen starting in midfield. IMO, they are simply not good enough if we want to be penetrative and threatening because they don't offer much, if not nothing at all, in attack.

They don't offer much protection to the defence either.  I agree Lucas and Poulsen are just not good enough but it is unlikely that Woy will admit he has bought a dud.  We can all see the problem and the solution.  Why can't our manager.

Time to put trust in some of our younger players ,Never play Poulsen again Roy ! why not use Shelvey in midfield ? Pacheco instead of Babel and N'gog,let's show some F***ing passion ! when we play !

I can remember when Fowler and Rush were our first line of defense,  if the opposition scored, we just scored one more than them, that was testament to the players who played behind them that could create the chances for them to put away.

it's like a new manager (Roy) comes to your office and immediately outsources (AA) the creative head of the department

Worst central midfield performance I have ever witnessed tonight.

Lucas needlessly giving the ball away, making stupid fouls, touch of a rapist offering nothing at all in the final third.

Poulsen ball watching, giving teh ball away, needless fouls offering nothing defensively.

Honestly if any one wants to start looking at teh cause of our problems, two players here not fit to be in the starting XI at Liverpool F.C in my opinion, both are extremely limited footballers that stop the team from functioning and playing fluid football.

I'm livid at their performances tonight !!!!

I'm also livid at Roy for sticking Meireles on the right who when drifted infield to a more central position he had a greater impact on the game. !!!

Worst central midfield performance I have ever witnessed tonight.

Lucas needlessly giving the ball away, making stupid fouls, touch of a rapist offering nothing at all in the final third.

Poulsen ball watching, giving teh ball away, needless fouls offering nothing defensively.

Honestly if any one wants to start looking at teh cause of our problems, two players here not fit to be in the starting XI at Liverpool F.C in my opinion, both are extremely limited footballers that stop the team from functioning and playing fluid football.

YAWN....

joe cole useless, as was meireles and kuyt, with torres moping around like a pregnant schoolgirl.

but yeah, blame lucas again.

this obsession is getting really boring - what part of "the creativity comes from the full backs and the central playmaker" do you find so difficult to understand?

Our midfield is laughable, I've said this after every game I've seen them together the worse midfield pairing I've ever seen at Liverpool

YAWN....

joe cole useless, as was meireles and kuyt, with torres moping around like a pregnant schoolgirl.

but yeah, blame lucas again.

this obsession is getting really boring - what part of "the creativity comes from the full backs and the central playmaker" do you find so difficult to understand?

What central F***ing play maker, we didnt have one ?

We played with two defensive midfielders, Meireles on the right, Cole on the left and Kuyt supporting Nando.

Lucas was shocking tonight as was his midfield partner, did you even watch the game ?

Did you see Lucas play a back pass to one of their players ?

Did you see Lucas chase that player down and concede a foul in a dangerous position he did not need to concede ?

Did you see Lucas recieve a simple pass that he badly controlled with a touch of a rapist and had to chase the loose ball for around ten yards.

Did you see Lucas totally allow his man to run off him get him a free header at goal that created a goal mouth scramble that led to us almost conceding  from a corner ?

Did you see Lucas offer us anything as a creative outlet consitently ?

Did you see Lucas provide solid defensive cover consistently ?

So please tell me exactly what both he and his midfield partner offered us tonight, because frankly I'm F***ing mystified !!!

Poulsen ball watching, giving teh ball away, needless fouls offering nothing defensively.

The lad is a proper chicken.

YAWN....

joe cole useless, as was meireles and kuyt, with torres moping around like a pregnant schoolgirl.

but yeah, blame lucas again.

this obsession is getting really boring - what part of "the creativity comes from the full backs and the central playmaker" do you find so difficult to understand?

I'd love you to explain it mate, please as I'm finding it difficult to understand.

F**k me Kenny if Lucas knocked shot someone you'd blame the person for getting in the way of the bullet. He doesn't deserve any defence tonight he was F***ing abysmal as was Poulsen