UEFA: Liverpool 'not worst fans' in Europe (after Platini update)

I notice your last post was nearly two months ago when you where telling us to “move on” from Hillsborough, now after trawling through You tube you have finally found some “extensive” footage of the serious crowd trouble that went on in Athens, now I by know means condone any sort of violence least of all because of a sporting event but does it not surprise you that UEFA haven’t gone on about your scenes from The Football Factory but have instead centred investigations around the stadium itself? Yes we have a minority of trouble makers as unfortunately do a lot of clubs and yes those so called fans let us down but if its severe enough we more than most clubs know they will take sanctions but funny enough they have already said we wont be facing any. If you had read the discussion properly you would know we are not happy with UEFA tagging us “The worst in Europe” because flags have gone missing at the ground and the ticketing arrangements for such a high powered organisation where turned into a circus by idiots who where that desperate to get in they would do anything even if it meant loyal fans who had paid in full missing out.
Now if you seriously think Athens and these other 24 incidents over four years (that UEFA have now said are “small”) are equal to shooting dead a policeman or riding the streets on scooters randomly stabbing victims or even as demonstrated at the weekend attacking a referee in the middle of a match then I am sorry but you are a lost cause and way beyond reasoning with.

First of all I did not "trawl" around youtube. I discovered it on a Cork City FC forum, www.ccfcforum.com

Now I by no means am anti-Liverpool. In fact I admire your support (bar the scumbags).

I do not understand this statement "UEFA haven’t gone on about your scenes from The Football Factory but have instead centred investigations around the stadium itself?".

Now I agree that I would be angry with being called the "Worst Fans In Europe" but, no offence, ye are pretty close to it, in my opinion.

Now to answer your last paragraph, Athens was not as bad as the incidents you have mentioned. But it was a Godsend that people were not killed, due to the mis management of UEFA and so-called Liverpool fans.

If you read my post then you will see that I said not all Liverpool fans are scum. The ones who paid good money to get there and were left out are the ones I feel for. I clearly said that I was condemning the fans who bought counterfit tickets.

It's time to take off your Liverpool tinted glasses....

The ones with the forged tickets are supporters of Liverpool, the ones who didn't qualify in the ballot.
These are the ones who booked there trip to Athens beleiving they had the criteria for a ticket.
If they cancelled there trip, they would of lost all money paid out for the trip.
I would of been one of these if I never got a ticket.
Now I saw what happened out there, and if you fancy getting whacked by a baton waving riot cop then fair enough, but they had no crowd control what so ever.
There were NO TURNSTYLES, NO PROPER TICKETS CHECKS, all you had to do was stick your ticket up in the air.

No put it this way - if you followed your team, and never qualified for a ticket (tho' you deserved to) had booked your trip early - to save on extortionate prices, and had the chance to get in with a forged ticket - what honestly would you do ??
The pictures you have seen are the ones UEFA want you to see, do they show you the women and kids crying after seeing innocent people getting hit ?
The reason why they are getting hit are not from forged ticket owners pushing there way through, but from poor organisation and no crowd control.
They think that brute force was going to control the crowd. Now if people run through, trying to avoid being hit or sprayed with tear gas, what would you do with a forged ticket - just stand there

As for tinted glasses - I was there mate, I saw what happened mate, so take off your media tinted glasses !!

Now I agree that I would be angry with being called the "Worst Fans In Europe" but, no offence, ye are pretty close to it, in my opinion.

Crawl back into your little hole, grow up and come back when your voice breaks.

I would do all in my power to get a real ticket but I would never stoop so low as to letting my fellow fans suffer for what I did.

Would you really have got a forged ticket and let other Liverpool fans suffer for your actions?

But as I've said previosuly, I blame both UEFA and SOME Liverpool fans. If UEFA had organized things properly and if counterfit tickets were not made available then we would not be having this discussion.

And for your final comment, I would have though that Sky Sports (the sports news channel I'd watch mostly) would be defending Liverpool as they defended Man United, being an English channel.

I agree with your Brute force comment. It's the same thing that happened with Man United in Rome and I think it's a disgrace. I feel if they had made it there would have been casualties.

Edit: I hope you see the irony in the added bit of your post. Quite immature, in my opinion. People don't agree with you so you just attack them (which you also did in a previous post)? :

First of all I did not "trawl" around youtube. I discovered it on a Cork City FC forum, www.ccfcforum.com

But you felt the need to share your evidence on a LFC forum, did you ever wonder why fans of Cork City would put such a thing on there own website? Put it this way I wouldn't be surprised if it appeared on a Man Utd website, if you aren't anti Liverpool how about taking part in other more positive topics?

I do not understand this statement "UEFA haven’t gone on about your scenes from The Football Factory but have instead centred investigations around the stadium itself?".

I cant actually see your videos as I am in work but I am guessing as to what film it is as you mentioned missiles and flares being thrown, I am implying you see this footage as some sort of damming evidence about hooligan Liverpool support but UEFA are not even looking at anything else that happened that day but how ticketless fans gained access to the stadium.

Now I agree that I would be angry with being called the "Worst Fans In Europe" but, no offence, ye are pretty close to it, in my opinion.

Facts please, you name the incidents that make us the worst and I will reply with twice as many from Turkey, Italy, Germany, Poland, Holland and so on, yes you did finish with in my opinion but I'm afraid it's a misinformed one.

Now to answer your last paragraph, Athens was not as bad as the incidents you have mentioned. But it was a Godsend that people were not killed, due to the mis management of UEFA and so-called Liverpool fans.

Finally a sensible statement and I agree with the order you put them in 1. Uefa mismanagement 2.SOME Liverpool fans

I would do all in my power to get a real ticket but I would never stoop so low as to letting my fellow fans suffer for what I did.

What do you think Liverpool supporters did ?
11,000 tickets went to the supporters for the biggest match in Europe for League sides.
That may be plenty for some teams, but at Liverpool we have 27,000 season ticket holders, and we had over 27,000 in the first ballot of 7,700 tickets.
How much more can our supporters do in obtain a ticket through genuine measures ??
and don't even go down the route of touts.
and you wonder why I attack you when I disagree with you, I have facts - you have false opinions

But you felt the need to share your evidence on a LFC forum, did you ever wonder why fans of Cork City would put such a thing on there own website? Put it this way I wouldn't be surprised if it appeared on a Man Utd website, if you aren't anti Liverpool how about taking part in other more positive topics?

Cork people are not anti-Liverpool/English etc. etc. In fact alot of people in the county support Liverpool. And the Admin of the forum despises Man United so that would help negative Liverpool stuff coming up

I cant actually see your videos as I am in work but I am guessing as to what film it is as you mentioned missiles and flares being thrown, I am implying you see this footage as some sort of damming evidence about hooligan Liverpool support but UEFA are not even looking at anything else that happened that day but how ticketless fans gained access to the stadium.

Are you saying that the videos are from that film or are you saying that the people who started these incidents watched too much movies like this?

Facts please, you name the incidents that make us the worst and I will reply with twice as many from Turkey, Italy, Germany, Poland, Holland and so on, yes you did finish with in my opinion but I'm afraid it's a misinformed one.

I apologise for this statement as I now see it was rash, though I still feel ye have SOME bad fans. How many I do not know. Could you give me a rough idea? As in tiny minority, small minority, half and half etc.

Finally a sensible statement and I agree with the order you put them in 1. Uefa mismanagement 2.SOME Liverpool fans

I did not write them in any specific order.

Cork people are not anti-Liverpool/English etc. etc. In fact alot of people in the county support Liverpool. And the Admin of the forum despises Man United so that would help negative Liverpool stuff coming up

That is why I expressed my surprise at it being posted on your forum, dont you think it would have been better left on You tube?

I apologise for this statement as I now see it was rash, though I still feel ye have SOME bad fans. How many I do not know. Could you give me a rough idea?

Thanks for the apology, yes we do have some "boys" who follow us around but then of course every team does, and if you didn't know the lower down the divisions you go in England the more likely you are to see football violence. As for numbers sorry I dont know.

I did not write them in any specific order.
No but none the less they ARE in the right order!

As for the football factory i was saying UEFA have not took any action or even mentioned  the you tube footage, so its hardly the football factory is it?

Cork's response is typical of the understanding of the majority of football fans around the country.

Heard it all from United fans myself.  One of them had conveniently forgot around 300 of their fans clashed with Roma fans and police outside Old Trafford a couple of months ago.  And then when he had remembered he said 'Yeah. But that was just revenge.'

Anyway, Platini sh*t bag has retracted his statement today after meeting Dick Caborn.  Surely Gaillard should now be sacked if he was actually lying.

(from BBC Sport)....

Platini retracted that statement, saying: "Not they are not. It's official, they aren't the worst behaved in Europe."

Before meeting Platini in Brussels, Caborn had appealed for Uefa to stop blaming Reds fans for the ticket problems which had dogged the final in Athens.

Caborn said: "Platini wants to make sure we don't have a repeat of events in Athens. We want to learn from the past and make sure we can have safe grounds for supporters.

"I suggested they set up a working party, which was well-received by Platini, and I have offered the expertise of the Football Licensing Authority who are respected on a worldwide basis.

"They'll be looking at major European finals and I hope they can start setting some standards for clubs entering the competitions that they have to meet certain criteria."

Tom Hicks also weighed in with his version.

Liverpool co-owner Tom Hicks had reacted angrily to Gaillard's condemnation of fans' behaviour.

He said: "The guy from Uefa who said that doesn't know what he's talking about.

"Uefa did not handle this right at all. To give 17,000 tickets to the two teams, particularly knowing Liverpool are going to bring 40,000 fans, is insane.

"It's a classic case of a bureaucrat trying to take the pressure off himself. They didn't handle it right, they didn't have proper ticketing procedures and unfortunately there were counterfeit tickets.

"There were fans who paid their hard-earned money to get their tickets and they get to the stadium and are told there is no more room."

well, here we go...now get the sack Gaillard there cant be other options for him now...or to resign, which would be probably what will happen. Saying that he might come back on the press that he never said what he said? wont be the first time, moron!!

Just read through everyones comments on this...

I'm starting to like Hicks a lot, he brought a better approach than Rick did. He stated the obvious, and that's what I like about him. Parry was too busy trying to brown nose off Uefa so we don't cause any problems in their competition.

Just read about all the Cork City's comments and video's. Again, it was UEFA's fault to put Liverpool fans and AC Milan fans within a few feet of each other. No common sense used there. As JD said, the vast majority of Football fans will bring this up over and over.

That clown Platini and Galliard have apologized, we've hit back - twice.

I for one cannot be arsed with UEFA at the moment.

Hicks told it straight.

Parry just talked a load of bull sh*t, squirming around the issue.

I agree Jabba, I for one think Parry should have been sacked a long time ago...

It's only a matter of time.  When the Yanks are 'really' running the show they will replace him.

Spot on, his reply to UEFA was pitiful and weak.

Well Cork City F.C. before shouting your gob off you should have considered this. YOUR team are in a cup final. You've watched them all season home and away. You're a sesason ticket holder so you assume you qualify for a final ticket. Due to a ballot for only 10,000 tickets allocated to your club, you don't get one. You still travel to the final venue where touts are selling tickets outside the ground. The tickets are face value. £40. 00. You are offered two for £90. 00. At that price, probably forged so you move on. A pair for you and your mate, £ 200. 00 You buy them, how do you know they're not Forgeries. You can't scan them. You've got nothing to compare them with.  It's 20mins to kick off. The price is about right for final tickets from touts. You  get in the ground due to the lack of oficial checks. You are not aware you have forgeries, you don't know you're in somebody elses seat.You don't even know whats going on outside the ground with people who have got genuine tickets and can't get in because the grounds full. So all the genuine ticket holders just turn around and go home without any complaint, or any effort to get into the ground for which they've paid. Never mind, we'll try again next time. I DON'T THINK SO ! F***ing WAKE UP LAD, GET A F***ing LIFE.!!!!!!

Well Cork City F.C. before shouting your gob off you should have considered this. YOUR team are in a cup final. You've watched them all season home and away. You're a sesason ticket holder so you assume you qualify for a final ticket. Due to a ballot for only 10,000 tickets allocated to your club, you don't get one. You still travel to the final venue where touts are selling tickets outside the ground. The tickets are face value. £40. 00. You are offered two for £90. 00. At that price, probably forged so you move on. A pair for you and your mate, £ 200. 00 You buy them, how do you know they're not Forgeries. You can't scan them. You've got nothing to compare them with.  It's 20mins to kick off. The price is about right for final tickets from touts. You  get in the ground due to the lack of oficial checks. You are not aware you have forgeries, you don't know you're in somebody elses seat.You don't even know whats going on outside the ground with people who have got genuine tickets and can't get in because the grounds full. So all the genuine ticket holders just turn around and go home without any complaint, or any effort to get into the ground for which they've paid. Never mind, we'll try again next time. I DON'T THINK SO ! f***ing WAKE UP LAD, GET A f***ing LIFE.!!!!!!

Well put Gerns.
What Mr Cork has pointed out about "scumbag liverpool fans" buying forgeries is irrelevant really. Forgeries will always be about and have been for many years. What is relevant is the facilities should have been in place to stop the forgeries in the first place!!! If these facilities were never in place for any big global sports events, ever, then he'd be wasting a lot more of his time posting on so many other teams forums. I seen his first post as a provocation to upset rather than to debate. So I'm not gonna waste anymore time on his views.
All I'll say is this. Until he has spent massive and precious amounts of time and money, travelling around europe to support the team he loves for years and then to be treated like an animal, a leper, or a disease, by governing bodies, the police and sometimes other fans, he'll soon realise who the scumbags are!!
It's always the same for ENGLISH fans! Not just Liverpool fans.

well, here we go...now get the sack Gaillard there cant be other options for him now...or to resign, which would be probably what will happen. Saying that he might come back on the press that he never said what he said? wont be the first time, moron!!

Very funny and very true Cy! I wouldn't be surprised if he did!
Gaillard is obviously not up to the job, but then we've known that for a while now haven't we. The only slight positive to come out of his disgraceful and slanderous comments is to see Platini squerm when saying "it's official, they are not the worst"! Surely putting his boss in a position like that calls for some disciplinary action??

UEFA AGREE FINALS REVIEW

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/drilldown/N156112070606-1033.htm



UEFA have agreed to review their security and crowd control procedures for future Champions League finals following the problems in Athens last month.

Sports Minister Richard Caborn yesterday met with UEFA president Michel Platini, after which the Frenchman was keen to distance himself from outrageous accusations from one of his senior colleagues that Liverpool fans were the worst behaved in Europe.
 
Asked whether Liverpool fans were to blame for trouble at some of the gates ahead of the clash with AC Milan, Platini said: "No, we cannot say that. We cannot point the finger. And, no, they are not the worst behaved in Europe.
 
"The issue is not that they are English or Spanish, one club or another. It is simply about fans who travel without tickets. This is an old story. It is just that more English fans follow their clubs than those from other countries. It is not as if one set of fans are good or one set bad."
 
Yesterday's hour long talks between Caborn and Platini in Brussels were described as 'constructive', with both sides now focused on finding solutions to the problems experienced by some English fans in Europe this season.
 
Caborn said: "I suggested they set up a working party, which was well received by Mr Platini, and I have offered the expertise of the Football Licensing Authority, who are respected on a worldwide basis.
 
"They will be looking at major European finals and I hope they can start setting some standards for clubs entering the competitions that they have to meet certain criteria."
 
Liverpool Chief Executive Rick Parry was also pleased to hear that a positive way forward was now on the agenda.
 
"I was in close dialogue with Richard Caborn both before and after the meeting and am pleased that he has kept us informed throughout," he said.
 
"We obviously welcome Mr Platini's comments regarding our supporters and the fact that a constructive way ahead has been agreed which should benefit fans from all clubs."

Just that last bit about what Rick Parry said, he's again brown nosing Platini's arse along with his colleagues. I don't think we should ever forgive UEFA (as fans) for slamming a huge tag on EVERY Liverpool fan out there, claiming we are the worst fans in Europe. These accusations make me furious.

And Cork City, you can shove your videos. Don't come on here prancing around with Liverpool fans caught in a little bit of a tangle with Milan fans because of they were in within a few yards of each other.

Still angry - whats your opinions?

And now, the latest, the UEFA report listing these 25 incidents is to be kept 'confidential'.

Let's recap.

1. 'We were the worst in Europe' - '25 incidents involving Liverpool fans' - Gaillard
2. There will be no punishments for us - UEFA Spokesman
3. 'We are definitely not the worst in Europe' - Michel Platini
4. The report is confidential - UEFA spokesman

The word bullshit was invented for such things as UEFA's handling of itself in the last few days.

(From the Echo...)

Uefa report on Reds fans is ‘confidential’Jun 6 2007
 
by Mike Hornby, Liverpool Echo
 
UEFA’S so-called dossier on Liverpool fans may never see the light of day.

The document was finally presented to sports minister Richard Caborn yesterday by Uefa president Michel Platini.

But no-one was prepared to give details of the alleged 25 incidents involving Reds’ supporters in Europe, on the grounds that the report was confidential.

A chastened Uefa spokesman, William Gaillard, tried to set the record straight, admitting Liverpool fans were not “the worst behaved in Europe”.

But he stopped short of apologising for the leaked report.


Uefa pledged yesterday to use English expertise to try to avoid the problems encountered this season.


They intend to set up a working party to look into suitable venues for major European finals and Mr Caborn offered them help from the Football Licensing Authority, the body set up in the wake of the Hillsborough disaster.


Mr Caborn said: “I told Uefa that there was no point in playing the blame game. We have to move on. I wanted assurances that Athens would not be repeated and that never again would any fans be put in this position. I got that assurance.”


Another outcome appears to be that the report into Liverpool fans’ behaviour may now never see the light of day.


Mr Caborn said: “The report was given to us on a confidential basis and we will respect that confidence.


“Reds fans may feel aggrieved, but we think they will agree that we have got a good result.”


Privately, ministers and civil servants in the department of culture, media and sport blame Uefa's organisation rather than Reds fans for the chaos.


But they accept there will be no post mortem on the slur report provided Uefa delivers on its promises.


Today, it emerged Liverpool supporters are planning to force Uefa to hand over documents relating to the Athens safety scare.


Lawyers representing fans suing the organisation said they planned to demand disclosure of documents to build up a “minute by minute” account of how the chaos unfolded.


More than 20 fans have now joined the legal action, demanding compensation after spending thousands of pounds on flights and tickets, only to be refused entry to the ground.


FLA influence is welcomed


PHIL Hammond, of the Hillsborough Family Support Group, welcomed news that the Football Licensing Authority will play a more active role in the organisation of big European games.


He said: “It is good news that the FLA will have some influence because they have done a lot of good.


“But who is going to be on this working party? Heaven forbid it should be Gaillard or some other executives whose only experience of football is from the directors’ box.


“It should be real fans, who save up to go to these games and know what the issues are.


“I was disappointed for Liverpool supporters that Platini didn’t apologise and Gaillard has not been sacked. Who is going to believe anything he says now?”

What do you think Liverpool supporters did ?
11,000 tickets went to the supporters for the biggest match in Europe for League sides.
That may be plenty for some teams, but at Liverpool we have 27,000 season ticket holders, and we had over 27,000 in the first ballot of 7,700 tickets.
How much more can our supporters do in obtain a ticket through genuine measures ??
and don't even go down the route of touts.
and you wonder why I attack you when I disagree with you, I have facts - you have false opinions

Doesn't the videos I linked count?


And to the other fellas here, Gerns in particular. It depends what final you are on about. A Champions League final ticket would sell for a lot more than £90 so I would assume that that was fake. I would prefer not to pay a tout anyway. It's not as if my club will get the money. It will just go straight into his back pocket.

And as for the fans with the genuine tickets, those are not the people who I am blaming. It is the people who bought forgeries. If they did not buy them, then the fans in possesion of genuine tickets would have been aloud in.

And I am also blaming UEFA for their bad planning. But it is outside their power to stop tickets being copied. It's not as if they can check everyone to see if they are copying tickets.

By the way, did Gaillard say that Liverpool had great fans before the game and terrible fans afterwards?

Cork. You're not a Liverpool supporter. You probably have no hope of ever supporting you're team in a European Cup Final. So,

at Istanbul GENUINE tickets were on sale outside the ground for face value - £40, £50.

How on earth can you blame Liverpool fans for unknowingly buying forgeries for around £300 / £400?

well, here we go...now get the sack Gaillard there cant be other options for him now...or to resign, which would be probably what will happen. Saying that he might come back on the press that he never said what he said? wont be the first time, moron!!

Well Cy, how right you were mate!
Radio City news reporter Julia Bold has been trying to get a small interview with Gaillard since his comments about us and she finally tracked him down. Radio City have put the interview on their website for anyone to listen to. What a joke!!! Have a listen to this and laugh at how ridiculous he's proved himself to be.
Just click on the play button to listen:

Click here

Very good link there redkenny, thanks for that. It just show how little the man is saying " I never said that" is a pure lie! How can he possibly saying that he didnt said that! and also the fact to hang up show a blatant disrespect to first the person who interview him, good work and to all Liverpool fan..in all like I said a moron...

Galliard is an absolutey spineless w**ker, hiding behind his bullshit 'nothing more to say' bollocks. 
This man piece of sh*t is obviously at home in the circus that is UEFA, pity he can't be thrown to the tigers at Knowsley Safari Park. They would almost certainly turn away from this tasteless shitforbrains.
 I hear this worst fans in Europe bollocks from a chav at work. I remind him that their fans are amongst the worst in Europe for these reasons:

1. Firstly you have to support a club that actually gets into European Finals to aspire to be the best..
2. Plastic flags handed out at a Euro semi doesn't make you great fans, it was a cheap stunt that lacked class.
3. Their stadium on matchday is like the surface of the moon - there is no atmosphere there. Unless Liverpool are in town. 

So are we the worst or the best? 40,000 fans in Athens, 1000's in the UK and abroad, AC Milan returning ticket allocations and chavs not needing passports for a final that they can't get into, again. All the while Liverpool FC is Never Walking Alone and unless you have lost your senses you will see and hear that we have the best fans in Europe by far!

And just another thought, it's all silly name calling reminiscent of a school playground.
Sticks and stones may break our bones but names will never hurt us...
If it doesn't break you it makes you stronger...
It's the rough with the smooth scenario - The toughest and strongest fighters are exactly that because they have a spine, a backbone and deal with whatever sh*t is thrown at them.
Liverpool FC and it's fans and Scousers in general have a reputation for rising above adversity and while others may take pot shots at us we will always overcome and rise above it, YNWA