NESV/Fenway Sports Group: Owners of LFC

I think the difference is, that under FSG the manager has never had total control of his transfer budget. Before FSG while the manager had to live within a budget, had scouts recommendations etc etc, the budget was his to spend, so if he decided it would be better to blow it all on a couple of top players or spread it out between 6 squad players, it was his choice.

Now policy is decided by committee and whilst the manager may have the final say on whether we sign a particular player or not, the policy and team planning in not solely in his hands. Hence we get the situation where Brendan is saying we need top players not more squad players, whilst the committee decide to spread it around on 5 or 6 squad players. This makes building a team (squad) that much more difficult when you have different visions of the way forward.

Personally I haven't been too thrilled with the players that we have signed which were so called "Brendan choices" anyway, so I am not unduly worried, but IMO it would have been better to have a D.O.F. if this was the way we were going rather than death by committee.   

I think the difference is, that under FSG the manager has never had total control of his transfer budget. Before FSG while the manager had to live within a budget, had scouts recommendations etc etc, the budget was his to spend, so if he decided it would be better to blow it all on a couple of top players or spread it out between 6 squad players, it was his choice.

Now policy is decided by committee and whilst the manager may have the final say on whether we sign a particular player or not, the policy and team planning in not solely in his hands. Hence we get the situation where Brendan is saying we need top players not more squad players, whilst the committee decide to spread it around on 5 or 6 squad players. This makes building a team (squad) that much more difficult when you have different visions of the way forward.

Personally I haven't been too thrilled with the players that we have signed which were so called "Brendan choices" anyway, so I am not unduly worried, but IMO it would have been better to have a D.O.F. if this was the way we were going rather than death by committee.

But if the manager has final say then he surely must have control on the players arrive and therefore having control over his budget ?

I think the difference is, that under FSG the manager has never had total control of his transfer budget. Before FSG while the manager had to live within a budget, had scouts recommendations etc etc, the budget was his to spend, so if he decided it would be better to blow it all on a couple of top players or spread it out between 6 squad players, it was his choice.

Now policy is decided by committee and whilst the manager may have the final say on whether we sign a particular player or not, the policy and team planning in not solely in his hands. Hence we get the situation where Brendan is saying we need top players not more squad players, whilst the committee decide to spread it around on 5 or 6 squad players. This makes building a team (squad) that much more difficult when you have different visions of the way forward.

Personally I haven't been too thrilled with the players that we have signed which were so called "Brendan choices" anyway, so I am not unduly worried, but IMO it would have been better to have a D.O.F. if this was the way we were going rather than death by committee.   

Problem is, the manager doesn't want DOF and FSG dropped it because of the manager's request.

Problem is, the manager doesn't want DOF and FSG dropped it because of the manager's request.

Probably one of FSG's biggest mistakes.

With how swift we have done our business this summer and the rumour that Ayre has been moved aside and Gordon, along with Fallows, taking the reins on transfers I'm more convinced that it was Ayre, and the gap between him and those above, where we have went wrong in transfers previously.

But if the manager has final say then he surely must have control on the players arrive and therefore having control over his budget ?

There is a difference between having your pick of any freely available player and having your pick from a list made up by a committee.

Problem is, the manager doesn't want DOF and FSG dropped it because of the manager's request.

I know mate, but it was a mistake imo. I said at the time that a top D.O.F. like Cruyff would have been the better option. He would have been able to attract better players and as someone steeped in football would have been better able to understand the needs and requirements necessary to build a team capable of winning.

Sadly there is no one on the committee who would impress a top player by their name , even Brendan is (or was) hardly a household name, while Ayre or Gordon are probably great at working out the cost but not at explaining just how a player will fit into our team and what role we see for them. 

I think when we took the risk of appointing a relatively unknown manager we should have insisted on a "big name" D.o.f. to balance it.

There is a difference between having your pick of any freely available player and having your pick from a list made up by a committee.


I know mate, but it was a mistake imo. I said at the time that a top D.O.F. like Cruyff would have been the better option. He would have been able to attract better players and as someone steeped in football would have been better able to understand the needs and requirements necessary to build a team capable of winning.

Sadly there is no one on the committee who would impress a top player by their name , even Brendan is (or was) hardly a household name, while Ayre or Gordon are probably great at working out the cost but not at explaining just how a player will fit into our team and what role we see for them. 

I think when we took the risk of appointing a relatively unknown manager we should have insisted on a "big name" D.o.f. to balance it.

But its a list created by the scouts - the same as before under previous managers ?

BR has an input into the players that are scouted and has recommended players he wants.

He has the same input into player purchases as other managers have previously had.

We did have a DoF at one point - Comolli. His record isnt glowing.

But its a list created by the scouts - the same as before under previous managers ?

But before the manager had free choice as long as they were within his budget, now it seems from Brendan's statements that he is limited by the committee as to his choices.

 
BR has an input into the players that are scouted and has recommended players he wants.

There is a big difference between getting some players that you may choose and getting your choice of all the players especially when you are trying to build a balanced squad.

 
He has the same input into player purchases as other managers have previously had.

We did have a DoF at one point - Comolli. His record isnt glowing.

No he doesn't, previous to FSG our managers were allocated a budget and as long as they stayed within that budget they could spend it as they wished.  Comolli brought in Suarez, Henderson, Ibe ...compared to the committee he was a world beater

To make my point a little clearer it is like the difference between someone getting you a Boots gift card and someone giving you cash. The Boots gift voucher is very nice but not if you need a new shirt. 

But before the manager had free choice as long as they were within his budget, now it seems from Brendan's statements that he is limited by the committee as to his choices.

What statements ? The crucial word is "seems"

There is a big difference between getting some players that you may choose and getting your choice of all the players especially when you are trying to build a balanced squad.

No he doesn't, previous to FSG our managers were allocated a budget and as long as they stayed within that budget they could spend it as they wished.  Comolli brought in Suarez, Henderson, Ibe ...compared to the committee he was a world beater

Again - its all guess work how "exactly" players are purchased. But looking at the make up its no different to other clubs.

Scouts find players for the manager - he picks the players he wants - they buy them if within budget - same as before ?

BR also asks the scouting team to look at players that he wants ( that i know 100%happens )

I think what Stuey is trying to say, is too many cooks spoil the broth..

Take the whole idea of the transfer committee.

Its the equivalent of 4 or 5 people giving these ingredients to an award winning chef 2 28 oz. cans tomatoes, 1-2 tbsp tomato paste 1 large onion, 2 cloves of garlic, 1 lb. ground beef, dried oregan, crushed red pepper, salt and pepper, fresh basil , 1 package of noodles, 1 lb. mozzarella, 1/2 lb. good quality parmesan,1 lb. ricotta cheese and asking him to serve you up an award winning chicken dinner...

What about the Boot Room? Waste of time was it?

Act soft and somebody will buy you a dummy.

Be a sport and volunteer your services for free. 

What statements ? The crucial word is "seems"

Again - its all guess work how "exactly" players are purchased. But looking at the make up its no different to other clubs.

Scouts find players for the manager - he picks the players he wants - they buy them if within budget - same as before ?

BR also asks the scouting team to look at players that he wants ( that i know 100%happens )

Again no! He is restricted by the committee whereas before a manager was free to choose whomsoever he wanted as long as they were within budget. 

Brendan April 2013  .... "“It is quality we are after, not quantity. We see Coutinho and Sturridge's quality in January, if we bring in another three or four players of that quality and add that to what we have got then we have got a strong squad"

We actually brought in 8 players not the 3 or 4  Brendan wanted.


 April 2015...Brendan Rodgers insists Liverpool need quality rather than quantity this summer. “How they work has brought them success in their many businesses. They are not about to rip up the plan.

“They will continue to support the work they believe in which is wanting to get young players in who can be developed.

“If there’s a possibility of a senior player who can help the team and the value is right and that availability and affordability is there for them then I'm sure they will look at it.”

Again no! He is restricted by the committee whereas before a manager was free to choose whomsoever he wanted as long as they were within budget. 

Brendan April 2013  .... "“It is quality we are after, not quantity. We see Coutinho and Sturridge's quality in January, if we bring in another three or four players of that quality and add that to what we have got then we have got a strong squad"

We actually brought in 8 players not the 3 or 4  Brendan wanted.


 April 2015...Brendan Rodgers insists Liverpool need quality rather than quantity this summer. “How they work has brought them success in their many businesses. They are not about to rip up the plan.

“They will continue to support the work they believe in which is wanting to get young players in who can be developed.

“If there’s a possibility of a senior player who can help the team and the value is right and that availability and affordability is there for them then I'm sure they will look at it.”

Yep.

There has been a model of type of player that Bendan and the committee have had to broadly stick to which maybe isn't as strict at other clubs.

Again no! He is restricted by the committee whereas before a manager was free to choose whomsoever he wanted as long as they were within budget. 

Brendan April 2013  .... "“It is quality we are after, not quantity. We see Coutinho and Sturridge's quality in January, if we bring in another three or four players of that quality and add that to what we have got then we have got a strong squad"

We actually brought in 8 players not the 3 or 4  Brendan wanted.


 April 2015...Brendan Rodgers insists Liverpool need quality rather than quantity this summer. “How they work has brought them success in their many businesses. They are not about to rip up the plan.

“They will continue to support the work they believe in which is wanting to get young players in who can be developed.

“If there’s a possibility of a senior player who can help the team and the value is right and that availability and affordability is there for them then I'm sure they will look at it.”

As expressed above, all big clubs rely on more than one person to make transfer decisions.

Surely from our pattern of transfers it seems apparent that Brendan gets to pick some players and the "committee" gets to pick some - rather than all of them having a say in each player.

It seems apparent that Brendan's bigger money picks include Borini, Allen, Lambert (expensive for his age), Lallana and Lovren.

He wanted to pick Dempsey instead of Sturridge.

What is the evidence that giving the manager complete power over transfers would lead to a big upturn in our performance?

There is plenty of evidence he is a great coach - that's why he was brought to the club. Where are the list of amazing signings we can credit to him?

But its a list created by the scouts - the same as before under previous managers ?

BR has an input into the players that are scouted and has recommended players he wants.

He has the same input into player purchases as other managers have previously had.

We did have a DoF at one point - Comolli. His record isnt glowing.

Still did the Suarez deal, unlike the transfer committee who haven't really had a success story they can shout about yet!!

Again no! He is restricted by the committee whereas before a manager was free to choose whomsoever he wanted as long as they were within budget. 

Brendan April 2013  .... "“It is quality we are after, not quantity. We see Coutinho and Sturridge's quality in January, if we bring in another three or four players of that quality and add that to what we have got then we have got a strong squad"

We actually brought in 8 players not the 3 or 4  Brendan wanted.


 April 2015...Brendan Rodgers insists Liverpool need quality rather than quantity this summer. “How they work has brought them success in their many businesses. They are not about to rip up the plan.

“They will continue to support the work they believe in which is wanting to get young players in who can be developed.

“If there’s a possibility of a senior player who can help the team and the value is right and that availability and affordability is there for them then I'm sure they will look at it.”

Not strictly true though mate.
We missed out on Ronaldo and Vidic to name but 2, because Parry would not let the manager sign them, as the wages they wanted were deemed too high by him (Parry).

Nice to see you posting by the way.

Still did the Suarez deal, unlike the transfer committee who haven't really had a success story they can shout about yet!!

Even a blind squirrel finds the odd nut

And isnt Coutinho a success yet ? Sturridge ? Can ? and numerous other youngsters which cant be judged either way just yet.

As expressed above, all big clubs rely on more than one person to make transfer decisions.

Surely from our pattern of transfers it seems apparent that Brendan gets to pick some players and the "committee" gets to pick some - rather than all of them having a say in each player.

It seems apparent that Brendan's bigger money picks include Borini, Allen, Lambert (expensive for his age), Lallana and Lovren.

He wanted to pick Dempsey instead of Sturridge.

What is the evidence that giving the manager complete power over transfers would lead to a big upturn in our performance?

There is plenty of evidence he is a great coach - that's why he was brought to the club. Where are the list of amazing signings we can credit to him?

Which is why in my first post I said ..... "Personally I haven't been too thrilled with the players that we have signed which were so called "Brendan choices" anyway, so I am not unduly worried, but IMO it would have been better to have a D.O.F. if this was the way we were going rather than death by committee."

Not strictly true though mate.
We missed out on Ronaldo and Vidic to name but 2, because Parry would not let the manager sign them, as the wages they wanted were deemed too high by him (Parry).

Nice to see you posting by the way.

There will always be players that we can't afford for one reason or another and players that we miss out on because someone somewhere along the line fucks up (Parry was deliberately slow when he thought a player wasn't right for us) but I think the restrictions now are heavier and more restrictive than any manager has had to put up with since Shankly.   

We missed out on Rio Ferdinand under Houllier because it would have cost our full budget .... but that was the managers choice.

I think we lost Vidic because we tried to negotiate a lower price (perfectly acceptable) and the mancs swooped in and paid the asking price.   

Which is why in my first post I said ..... "Personally I haven't been too thrilled with the players that we have signed which were so called "Brendan choices" anyway, so I am not unduly worried, but IMO it would have been better to have a D.O.F. if this was the way we were going rather than death by committee."

Ah fair enough I didn't read the first post but the question still stands for plenty of others who have been advocating giving the manager total control.

Even a blind squirrel finds the odd nut

And isnt Coutinho a success yet ? Sturridge ? Can ? and numerous other youngsters which cant be judged either way just yet.

So Comolli baaaaaaaaaad

Transfer committee good.

At least Comolli has got some credentials in football, who makes up the transfer committee again and what the F**k have they ever done in football between them.

Answers on a postcard to Sweet FA!!!

Hahaha F**k off - and I'd give Can a full season in his preferred role rather than as a bastardised central defender or right-back!!

There will always be players that we can't afford for one reason or another and players that we miss out on because someone somewhere along the line fucks up (Parry was deliberately slow when he thought a player wasn't right for us) but I think the restrictions now are heavier and more restrictive than any manager has had to put up with since Shankly.   

We missed out on Rio Ferdinand under Houllier because it would have cost our full budget .... but that was the managers choice.

I think we lost Vidic because we tried to negotiate a lower price (perfectly acceptable) and the mancs swooped in and paid the asking price.   

Even Ferguson baulked at the money Leeds payed and then went and paid more for him from Leeds!!

So Comolli baaaaaaaaaad

Transfer committee good.

Didnt say that though.

At least Comolli has got some credentials in football, who makes up the transfer committee again and what the f**k have they ever done in football between them.

Hodgson had credentials in football as well. Both the head scout and Head of Analysis both have history and credentials in recruiting players.
Answers on a postcard to Sweet FA!!!

Hahaha F**k off - and I'd give Can a full season in his preferred role rather than as a bastardised central defender or right-back!!

So are Coutinho and Sturridge success or not ?

Didnt say that though.

Hodgson had credentials in football as well. Both the head scout and Head of Analysis both have history and credentials in recruiting players.
Answers on a postcard to Sweet FA!!!
So are Coutinho and Sturridge success or not ?

Can't you answer that yourself, Coutinho probably still needs another season and a few more goals and as for Sturridge still think the jury's out on whether he is that good or whether Suarez made him look that good, hard to judge last year as apart from the injuries he looked about as mobile as Super Mario!!