The great big Rafa debate

Their software hasn't been programmed with that information Billy they only have access to the propoganda machine.

What propaganda? we're not playing Barcelonaish football, we're not the top of the world where everyone wants to shoot us down, look at the "FACTS" we're playing sh*te football with player who gives F**k all with a manager who has been doing nothing to rectify it and just keep occupied with his chess game and political masquerade.

I'd say the media are right, the players are that bad, the managers are that bad, and the yanks are that bad.

Their software hasn't been programmed with that information Billy they only have access to the propoganda machine.
[/quote Well then they are trully fu**ed then Reddebs and by all accounts so is the future of the Liverpool support, Having to rely on the pro-Manc media for info and bullshit lies, They may as well call it the Tesco/united league with all the monopolising going on, What a boring future beholds us all.

And if someone's not performing to replace them but he wasn't even allowed 100% of player sales to do so.  Therefore ruling out the option of selling/replacing as the board didn't hold up their side of the agreement by allowing adequate transfer funds.  Don't get me wrong, low morale and poor performances should be attributed somewhat to Rafa but to think that he's solely responsible is ludicrous.  I don't know to what extent he should be held accountable because honestly I'm unsure of how much our players were affected by the levels of uncertainty at boardroom level and general unwillingness to invest in the squad by our owners.  Finishing second and both teams losing a key player, you'd think had we invested in a world class replacement for Xabi Alonso whilst the scum didn't, we'd be the favourites for the title. 

Essentially, this was dumb and dumber's chance to spend money to make money but instead they decided to not risk investing any of their own money but rather siphon money from the club and it's now actually backfired on them.  Imagine how much more Liverpool could be sold for now, if they invested some of their own money towards the squad and clearing some debt until it was at a manageable level.  Easily, easily, easily in excess of 1 billion.  Liverpool has risen in FINANCIAL stature vastly over the last few years.  It's now equally as attractive FINANCIALLY as it is historically.

You are living in a cuckoo land. 1 billion? With that sh*t football we're playing?

If and buts comes to mind, if munich didn't happen perhaps the mancs have been the best club ever, if Souness never manages us, if and buts, if the martian attacks, if and buts.

So Angelic - answer please...?

so what? just post the whole wiki pedia about how great liverpool of the past, the history of how you watch your first match, how you ended up in tears in Istanbul. Does that ease the pains of seeing how in a deep sh*t we are at the moment?

Keep on clinging to the past? Where every other clubs have move on, seeing 18-5 becomes 0-2? When others have move on to the 19th we'll keep clinging on the stories of our Shanks/Paisly era?

Just as yours filled with pro-rafa propaganda machine. It's just a vantage point

Glory hunter, I wouldn't be here if I were one. We haven't had the most glorious 20 years have we?

History is history, we keep on clinging how "GREAT" we are in the past won't going to change the future, people appreciate the past but look forward for the future and move on, instead of looking to the past and clinging to it.

Mate you need to wake up and smell the bullshit, It is very clear you are of a lets say somewhat short of a few brain cells, If you have a wee look at the last twenty yrs you'll find they have been dominated by some lot called Newton heath i believe to be  their original title, And they have been regularly successful because of having a half decent bloke in charge and someone else dipping their hand in their pocket to finance the very staff that brought them their aforementioned successes, Had we the same opportunities then i think we would not be having this debate, So before you continue to lambast and spit your drivel i suggest you wrap a Green and yellow scarf around your gob, Fairly tightly and stop the smell of sh*t reaching your nostrils, Its very clear your arsehole is just under your nose.

so what? just post the whole wiki pedia about how great liverpool of the past, the history of how you watch your first match, how you ended up in tears in Istanbul. Does that ease the pains of seeing how in a deep sh*t we are at the moment?

Keep on clinging to the past? Where every other clubs have move on, seeing 18-5 becomes 0-2? When others have move on to the 19th we'll keep clinging on the stories of our Shanks/Paisly era?

I asked for your choice of manager if Rafa goes...so can I have an answer please.

You are living in a cuckoo land. 1 billion? With that sh*t football we're playing?

Don't be such a tool - the football we're playing has little bearing on the financial implications.

Like you've been told, oh so many times, Liverpool is a BRAND now, with all that entails.

Mate you need to wake up and smell the bullshit, It is very clear you are of a lets say somewhat short of a few brain cells, If you have a wee look at the last twenty yrs you'll find they have been dominated by some lot called Newton heath i believe to be  their original title, And they have been regularly successful because of having a half decent bloke in charge and someone else dipping their hand in their pocket to finance the very staff that brought them their aforementioned successes, Had we the same opportunities then i think we would not be having this debate, So before you continue to lambast and spit your drivel i suggest you wrap a Green and yellow scarf around your gob, Fairly tightly and stop the smell of sh*t reaching your nostrils, Its very clear your arsehole is just under your nose.

Exactly, for 1 reason or another, LFC is not a prefered destination of glory hunter. Trust me, if I am a glory hunter I'll live happier and healthier supporting United rather than LFC.

The last time I checked they're not that far off the net spending compared to our God Rafael Benitez. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

You're gonna blame Chelsea's Roman for us cannot competing in the top 4? Citeh's money? Totenham Good luck? How bout Aston Villa? Arsenal? Oh.. the same reason, money and financial.

If LFC needs money before they can be succesful again , we're not that much different from the glory hunter, we're just the money hunter. Is that what we have become? whoring ourself begging to be rescued by a sugar daddy from the brothel we're in? The last time I check we called Chelsea renties, you want LFC to become one?

PS: If I were a Manc, I would wum you up to keep Rafa, he won't take us nowhere.

I asked for your choice of manager if Rafa goes...so can I have an answer please.

No matter who manages us, before the yanks are out it won't make much different.

I'd rather a manager who knows the condition isn't likely to change and just do with what he have, preferably buliding from the basic again, instiling believe and team work, starting from scratch. Instead of a "I can't do it without money, more more more manager"

Let the fans worry about the yanks, and the managers worry about his teamsheet

Don't be such a tool - the football we're playing has little bearing on the financial implications.

Like you've been told, oh so many times, Liverpool is a BRAND now, with all that entails.

You remember how much we're bought for?

Mate you need to wake up and smell the bullshit, It is very clear you are of a lets say somewhat short of a few brain cells, If you have a wee look at the last twenty yrs you'll find they have been dominated by some lot called Newton heath i believe to be  their original title, And they have been regularly successful because of having a half decent bloke in charge and someone else dipping their hand in their pocket to finance the very staff that brought them their aforementioned successes, Had we the same opportunities then i think we would not be having this debate, So before you continue to lambast and spit your drivel i suggest you wrap a Green and yellow scarf around your gob, Fairly tightly and stop the smell of sh*t reaching your nostrils, Its very clear your arsehole is just under your nose.

Half decent bloke? We have a very marvelous (ehm...) Rafa (Tactical genius as claimed by many) and he hasn't been half as succesful as that decent bloke.

Sorry to break the party, he's not even half as succesful as Mourinho, but then again that's due to money. It's all about money

What nonsense? Do you rate Shankly by who he bought or by his achivement? Blah, blah, blah…

PS: So you're saying everyone is world class manager if only their boards blank check them all teh way? What defines a good manager?

Sorry sonny but it’s not my fault that you can’t think straight.

It was you who said…

Managers are not judged by who they want, but they're judged on who they actually bought.

Are you trying to say that Shankly should be judged by who he bought?

I’m not responsible for what you say: if I were you would actually make sense.

I just posted the following to demonstrate how you really hadn’t thought that statement of yours through.

More nonsense.

What determines whether a particular player is bought or not is whether there is a budget for the transfer fee and wages.

Managers aren't responsible for setting transfer or wage budgets. Transfer budgets are set by the board and by the owners at Liverpool FC.

That’s why, for instance, we bought Rierra for £8.8m rather than Silva for say £35m.

Boards and owners are judged by transfer budgets because it’s they that set them not managers.

Oh, before you start saying that Rafa controls transfer policy… he doesn’t: the board does. He obtained an agreement with the board that he would be consulted on player transfers and the process would be streamlined (because we lost too many opportunities under Parry) as part of his new contract. That’s all.

No manager has total control of transfer policy.

You remember how much we're bought for?

What the F**k does that have to do with the football we've played?

2 big deals last season despite playing poorly - that's what being a BRAND does.

Are you really that thick that you can ignore the question in favour of some half arsed obtuse remark?

What the F**k does that have to do with the football we've played?

2 big deals last season despite playing poorly - that's what being a BRAND does.

Are you really that thick that you can ignore the question in favour of some half arsed obtuse remark?

If we're worth 1 Billion how come nobody's knocking when the yanks offered 800?

If we're worth 1 Billion how come nobody's knocking when the yanks offered 800?

I said nothing about 1 billion - I stated, as you very well know, that our worth isn't judged by the football we play.

Yes, I was right, you're being obtuse for the sake of it.

I said nothing about 1 billion - I stated, as you very well know, that our worth isn't judged by the football we play.

Yes, I was right, you're being obtuse for the sake of it.

My point is : Rafa is not the right man for us anymore, and I believe I'm not the only one with that point.

Sorry to break the party, he's not even half as succesful as Mourinho, but then again that's due to money. It's all about money

Well who'd have thunked it... he's finally figured it out.

No matter who manages us, before the yanks are out it won't make much different.

I'd rather a manager who knows the condition isn't likely to change and just do with what he have, preferably building from the basic again, instiling believe and team work, starting from scratch. Instead of a "I can't do it without money, more more more manager"

Let the fans worry about the yanks, and the managers worry about his teamsheet

Considering that 91% of the Premiership titles have gone to the team with the first or 2nd highest wage bill, than surely this is the era of the money - been outspent gross & net my Spurs & Man City & outspent net by Villa (O'Neill's net spend in the last 4 years is nearly equal to Rafa's in 6) as well in the last 6 seasons. People then may bring in the fact our wages are higher than Man City, Villa & Spurs, ignoring the fact that across Europe, teams that qualify regularly for the CL have an average wage bill of 25-30% higher than their rivals in the league.  

You have to wonder how long football clubs can go on incurring debt, before we start to get a big name casualty - maybe us.  The whole league needs a financial revamp, players will have to adjust to being paid less and the vultures that are agents will have to understand this.  Clubs will have to be forced to live WITHIN their financial means. I'd prefer us to be a mediocre team still in existence, than a footnote in history as one of the biggest teams in the world to go bankrupt.  I'm not saying I don't want success, but maybe we need some realism injected into our fans.  Maybe, just maybe, Rafa has, comparatively, overachieved in previous seasons.  

Considering that 91% of the Premiership titles have gone to the team with the first or 2nd highest wage bill, than surely this is the era of the money - been outspent gross & net my Spurs & Man City & outspent net by Villa (O'Neill's net spend in the last 4 years is nearly equal to Rafa's in 6) as well in the last 6 seasons. People then may bring in the fact our wages are higher than Man City, Villa & Spurs, ignoring the fact that across Europe, teams that qualify regularly for the CL have an average wage bill of 25-30% higher than their rivals in the league.   

You have to wonder how long football clubs can go on incurring debt, before we start to get a big name casualty - maybe us.  The whole league needs a financial revamp, players will have to adjust to being paid less and the vultures that are agents will have to understand this.  Clubs will have to be forced to live WITHIN their financial means. I'd prefer us to be a mediocre team still in existence, than a footnote in history as one of the biggest teams in the world to go bankrupt.  I'm not saying I don't want success, but maybe we need some realism injected into our fans.  Maybe, just maybe, Rafa has, comparatively, overachieved in previous seasons. 

I don't hear this last season. What about the "next year is our year" as much as it's lame and painful to repeat, at least we have believe, the players used to have believe, and the manager is as optimistic as ever.

At this rate I don't see any of them.

My point is : Rafa is not the right man for us anymore, and I believe I'm not the only one with that point.

I think i'm not the only one who keeps asking you this.................... . IN YOUR OPION WHO SHOULD BE MANAGER IN RAFA'S PLACE?

For fucks sake answer the question and stop F***ing ignoring it. If your so well informed that Rafa isn't the right person, then i'm sure you must know who should replace him.

FOR ONCE STOP F***ing IGNORING THE QUESTION YOU DUMB sh*t

My point is : Rafa is not the right man for us anymore, and I believe I'm not the only one with that point.

So who do you want in charge - who in your mind is good enough to take us forward.

Your views on rafa are clear but if you were in charge you have to have a replacement ready yet you want the manager gone without anyone coming in.

I think i'm not the only one who keeps asking you this.................... . IN YOUR OPION WHO SHOULD BE MANAGER IN RAFA'S PLACE?

For fucks sake answer the question and stop F***ing ignoring it. If your so well informed that Rafa isn't the right person, then i'm sure you must know who should replace him.

FOR ONCE STOP F***ing IGNORING THE QUESTION YOU DUMB sh*t

If I answer that does that makes me a dumb sh*t?

I don't hear this last season. What about the "next year is our year" as much as it's lame and painful to repeat, at least we have believe, the players used to have believe, and the manager is as optimistic as ever.

At this rate I don't see any of them.

I've never heard a Liverpool fan say "Next year is our year" without including the words 'I hope' in front, in fact on the premiership forums I have frequented, it is vastly attributed to us by opposition fans and never in context.  I always hope next year is our year, no matter what our situation, doesn't mean that I don't have realistic ambitions as well.