Manchester United 2-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion

The point is pal players do get older . But the fact remains this was the same midfield that challenged last year . Should it have been changed or adapted ? Probably , but the fact remains it did challenge last year

Oh so you admit we needed 1 or 2 new midfielders over the last couple of years to keep the squad fresh.

No idea why you are arguing then 🤷‍♂️

Everyone jumping on the midfield bandwagon which is a major problem but missing the most blatantly obvious issue of the right back . All teams need to do is put a speed merchant with skill down the left wing and it will cause us problems all game . Trent is not playing right back , not his fault he’s being asked to creat further upfield and we rely on the centre backs covering . Our centre backs are off form and all over the place because of injuries and there you have a massive problem . It’s so obvious that the opposition attacks down that side and chances are created . Look at all the goals scored against us recently from open play and it all comes down that side . Either play Trent in midfield and get a right back or stick with this failing system and suffer the consequences.

Oh so you admit we needed 1 or 2 new midfielders over the last couple of years to keep the squad fresh.

No idea why you are arguing then 🤷‍♂️

Point remains your comment was wrong I will end it there

Point remains your comment was wrong I will end it there

Ok 👍

Same game plan as last year and the years before that, nothings changed.

To be fair, that game plan has been fairly successful.

My criticism is that we know Oxlade-Chamberlain, Keita, Thiago are unreliable.  We know that Milner turns 37 in January.  We know that Henderson too has his injury issues when asked to play more than twice a week.  We also know that Curtis Jones perhaps hadn't kicked on like maybe was expected 18 months ago.

Liverpool should have been prioritising a midfielder and they may well have one lined up for next season but we probably need one this season.

To be fair, that game plan has been fairly successful.

My criticism is that we know Oxlade-Chamberlain, Keita, Thiago are unreliable.  We know that Milner turns 37 in January.  We know that Henderson too has his injury issues when asked to play more than twice a week.  We also know that Curtis Jones perhaps hadn't kicked on like maybe was expected 18 months ago.

Liverpool should have been prioritising a midfielder and they may well have one lined up for next season but we probably need one this season.

Add to that Harvey and Carvalho are very young we have 8 midfielders who do not make up a world class midfield its a definite weakness that has been exposed yet again

Oh so you admit we needed 1 or 2 new midfielders over the last couple of years to keep the squad fresh.

No idea why you are arguing then 🤷‍♂️

my issue with that is the quality we need is expensive and we have relied on Jürgen to make good players great players. We are carrying 3 injury prone players Milly and Hendo thats too much for a team to challenge City. We did exceptionally well last season this season is going to be difficult

my issue with that is the quality we need is expensive and we have relied on Jürgen to make good players great players. We are carrying 3 injury prone players Milly and Hendo thats too much for a team to challenge City. We did exceptionally well last season this season is going to be difficult

Probably just needed 1 player last season and another this season who didn’t need to be world class.

We need running power and discipline in the Midfield not players like Henderson and Milner vacate their positions leaving huge holes when there is a turn over.

Not sure if it’s Klopp being too loyal and not releasing players or the funds really are not there even in the 30-40M range 🤷‍♂️

Add to that Harvey and Carvalho are very young we have 8 midfielders who do not make up a world class midfield its a definite weakness that has been exposed yet again

Carvalho is not even a midfielder so we can discount him.

After that shitshow you'd wonder will we see Elliott and Carvalho start.

I know it would be insane to say it at the start of the season but with
the mid twenty somethings being made of glass it's like ok Starboys,
go get it.

So the midfield squad is not good enough.

Hendo: 32. Holding/playmaker/attacking support. Club captain, Still has plenty to offer but can't sustain 2 games a week. Not on the slide but approaching it. Wouldn't be that much of an issue if the rest of the Mid squad was strong.

Fabinho: 28.  Holding. Solid if a little predictable, sits in, tends to play the safe ball. Bit in the Hamann mode, reliable if unspectacular.

Thiago: 31.  Playmaker/attacking support. 31. Good passing range,can dictate the tempo, probing , not overly mobile, odd loose pass, won't score a screamer but can pop up for the odd goal.

Elliott: 19 . Attacking wide midfield. Still learning, energetic obviously, busy, not overly technical, quick but no lighting pace. Stronger on his left peg. Question mark over his ability to kick on to become a true LFC player.

Jones:21. Attacking midfield. Has come of age. Right footed, caught the imagination early on but hasn't backed it up. Very average performances, not enough impact to warrant a regular place. Bit of an enigma. Player in there somewhere, but has't surfaced just yet.

Naby Keita 27. Attacking midfield. Should be in his prime but it just hasn't happened. Promised a lot but injury/illness has dented his impact. Last year of a disappointing contract. Frustrated the fans and probably the Boss. Boss said he lacks confidence in himself and maybe the job was just too much for him.

The Ox:29. Attacking midfielder.  Again another who should be in his prime but in reality he just isn't a top player, average first touch, bit of pace, not overly skillful, injuries played a part but he hasn't in truth ever captured the imagination and has never commandeered a regular place.

Milner 36. Utility player. Fantastic professional, dedicated, can do a job anywhere, mostly midfield, solid right footed player, not overly technical or tricky close control. Coming to the end of his time here and has been a great signing.

Carvalho: 19. Attacking mid/forward. New kid on the block, great potential, very early days. Got a trick or 3. The future.

That's more or less the height of it. No KDB is there. Just looks a bit stale. One or two..poss 3 shouldn't really be here. Not getting any younger and the younger ones haven't as yet set the pace. Needs some serious surgery, not fatal but if it's left it could get worse. Won't say it looks a bit mid tableish but some might say it's going that way.

This malaise does not happen overnight. The signs have been there for a couple of seasons. We need fresh blood and we need it soon.

Malaise is a very good description:
I think perhaps some of us have forgotten how close we came the season before last to not making the top 4 (Allison's header)etc.
We look like we're playing in fog. You could even put up a good argument to say we're fortunate to have the 2 points we've got, we could have lost all 3 games.
There is merit in all the posts so far identifying the clear need to replace some of this squad. Sentiment never an attribute of the great managers.

Everyone jumping on the midfield bandwagon which is a major problem but missing the most blatantly obvious issue of the right back . All teams need to do is put a speed merchant with skill down the left wing and it will cause us problems all game . Trent is not playing right back , not his fault he’s being asked to creat further upfield and we rely on the centre backs covering . Our centre backs are off form and all over the place because of injuries and there you have a massive problem . It’s so obvious that the opposition attacks down that side and chances are created . Look at all the goals scored against us recently from open play and it all comes down that side . Either play Trent in midfield and get a right back or stick with this failing system and suffer the consequences.

He gets a rough time trent and it’s just a bad myth that he can’t defend. He does have the occasional shocker truth be told but a lot of that is down to salah. Mo doesn’t track back anywhere near the amounts mane did, and now how often Diaz does.

If you look at Robertson, he has virgil next to him, he had mane infront and then it was either gini or Milner playing lcm more often than not who were both great at covering him.

On trents side he plays with a different rcb every week, Mo who doesn’t track back and hendo as a rcm who doesn’t do as good of a job covering him as the other midfielders cover Robbo. Last night it was elliott in the rcm who didn’t cover him at all.

Rb is an issue I agree. But it’s not Trent. It’s the players around him that need to protect him far better.

So the midfield squad is not good enough.

Hendo: 32. Holding/playmaker/attacking support. Club captain, Still has plenty to offer but can't sustain 2 games a week. Not on the slide but approaching it. Wouldn't be that much of an issue if the rest of the Mid squad was strong.

Fabinho: 28.  Holding. Solid if a little predictable, sits in, tends to play the safe ball. Bit in the Hamann mode, reliable if unspectacular.

Thiago: 31.  Playmaker/attacking support. 31. Good passing range,can dictate the tempo, probing , not overly mobile, odd loose pass, won't score a screamer but can pop up for the odd goal.

Elliott: 19 . Attacking wide midfield. Still learning, energetic obviously, busy, not overly technical, quick but no lighting pace. Stronger on his left peg. Question mark over his ability to kick on to become a true LFC player.

Jones:21. Attacking midfield. Has come of age. Right footed, caught the imagination early on but hasn't backed it up. Very average performances, not enough impact to warrant a regular place. Bit of an enigma. Player in there somewhere, but has't surfaced just yet.

Naby Keita 27. Attacking midfield. Should be in his prime but it just hasn't happened. Promised a lot but injury/illness has dented his impact. Last year of a disappointing contract. Frustrated the fans and probably the Boss. Boss said he lacks confidence in himself and maybe the job was just too much for him.

The Ox:29. Attacking midfielder.  Again another who should be in his prime but in reality he just isn't a top player, average first touch, bit of pace, not overly skillful, injuries played a part but he hasn't in truth ever captured the imagination and has never commandeered a regular place.

Milner 36. Utility player. Fantastic professional, dedicated, can do a job anywhere, mostly midfield, solid right footed player, not overly technical or tricky close control. Coming to the end of his time here and has been a great signing.

Carvalho: 19. Attacking mid/forward. New kid on the block, great potential, very early days. Got a trick or 3. The future.

That's more or less the height of it. No KDB is there. Just looks a bit stale. One or two..poss 3 shouldn't really be here. Not getting any younger and the younger ones haven't as yet set the pace. Needs some serious surgery, not fatal but if it's left it could get worse. Won't say it looks a bit mid tableish but some might say it's going that way.

You would ideally look to replace

Ox and Milner

Then bring in someone to develop under Henderson and also someone like Teliemans ( I haven’t ever been that impressed with him )

Big trouble in the sense of being nowhere near the title and where we want to be I mean, just to quantify.

Leaving transfers aside, as we have strengthened the squad, it appears to me we've bought players over the last while but not thought of how they'll fit into the system or how well use them.

We seem so disjointed and persisting in playing different players than we had in the exact same way as we did a few years back.

I'm not convinced we're thinking about any new or different tactics or set up of the team to utilize the players we have now.

Each game this season smacks of a team devoid of any fresh or new ideas. The manager also is notorious for not making changes and this I fear could also bite us of we don't get out act together.

Also the players are showing the sign of being exhausted from last season.

I think you’re over reacting a bit. We’ve still got matip, fabinho, thiago, Jota to come back into our starting 11 from the team that started last night. Those four will make a huge difference to us.

I do agree with you though and sadly I think we’re out of the title race already. Crazy saying that only 3 games in. Out of the race maybe, but we aren’t in serious trouble. Yet.

I think you’re over reacting a bit. We’ve still got matip, fabinho, thiago, Jota to come back into our starting 11 from the team that started last night. Those four will make a huge difference to us.

I do agree with you though and sadly I think we’re out of the title race already. Crazy saying that only 3 games in. Out of the race maybe, but we aren’t in serious trouble. Yet.

I think this season has a lot of twists yet and the stop for the World Cup could be game changing for squads that don’t have players going - we just need to hang about until then

He gets a rough time trent and it’s just a bad myth that he can’t defend. He does have the occasional shocker truth be told but a lot of that is down to salah. Mo doesn’t track back anywhere near the amounts mane did, and now how often Diaz does.

If you look at Robertson, he has virgil next to him, he had mane infront and then it was either gini or Milner playing lcm more often than not who were both great at covering him.

On trents side he plays with a different rcb every week, Mo who doesn’t track back and hendo as a rcm who doesn’t do as good of a job covering him as the other midfielders cover Robbo. Last night it was elliott in the rcm who didn’t cover him at all.

Rb is an issue I agree. But it’s not Trent. It’s the players around him that need to protect him far better.

Ansolute tosh. Fabinho has covered his backside time and again as did gini .

The lad is cocky and he's lazy. He doesn't get back in even when he loses the ball. He couldn't defend if his life depended on it.

Robbo is a more than competent defender. And if he loses it he gets back in. If an attack breaks down he gets back in.

Trent just jogs back ... if he can be arsed. Like it's someone else's job to cover him, do his work and then pass it to him.

He needs challenging in that dressing room. His attitude isnt right. His attacking game isn't very good currently either .

Ansolute tosh. Fabinho has covered his backside time and again as did gini .

The lad is cocky and he's lazy. He doesn't get back in even when he loses the ball. He couldn't defend if his life depended on it.

Robbo is a more than competent defender. And if he loses it he gets back in. If an attack breaks down he gets back in.

Trent just jogs back ... if he can be arsed. Like it's someone else's job to cover him, do his work and then pass it to him.

He needs challenging in that dressing room. His attitude isnt right. His attacking game isn't very good currently either .

Bizarre post this.

If you don’t rate Trent, fine. But you’re not his dad mate, he doesn’t need ‘challenging’. The boy has won everything in the game. Some going for a lazy cocky c**t who can’t be arsed eh?

Lisandro Martinez has looked like Tyrion Lannister until he played us and now they're screaming Baresi.

F**k me we are a sh*t show right now

We started with the wrong attitude. I said to Keith in the week, that it would be a hard game. He didn't believe me. It would've been better if United had battered Brentford, then we might have been ready.

Yes you did and on all known form very hard to believe we could get a draw out of it let alone a win. You were right though, I couldn’t of predicted that.

F***ing hangover is bad and wasn't drinking last night.

Massive wake up call for the players.

Obviously will be pressure to sign a player or two, but at the end of the day, this core of players and the manager will need to regroup and bounce back.

We're better than how we've started the season. Players will come back from injury. Nunez will come back in.

But the players need to up their performances. Get back to basics, work hard, be aggressive, show energy, desire etc etc

Last night was nowhere near good enough.

We started with the wrong attitude. I said to Keith in the week, that it would be a hard game. He didn't believe me. It would've been better if United had battered Brentford, then we might have been ready.

I said the same mate. This is my comment in the pre-match thread on 20 August

We should be 6 points on the board ready to humiliate the bottom placed club and pick up another easy 3 points.

But because of our own pathetic displays and lack of effort, we go into this match barely favourites. Utd know they have a chance now when they should be expecting failure. They will pick themselves up and go for this... and yet we will have to pick ourselves up too. A must win for both teams.

Fingers crossed this is the game when we finally start playing football. I miss Mane. 

It was a bad time to play Utd. We haven't got going and look truly awful. Yesterday was pathetic. Utd were up for it, and it wouldn't be so bad if we tried, but we didn't. Widespread carelessness throughout the team and even Trent a scouser just didn't bother about Utd winning. We only started running around in the moments after going 2-0 down. Good job I'm not Klopp cause I would punish the lot of them.

Dominated that game last night for large parts, but fair play to manu they defended for their lives, and we never had enough options to change too much.