Brentford 3-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion

other than the result, that was no different from the game their last season. we got absolutely bullied all over the pitch. again. thats absolutely damning for Klopp and his staff.

Carragher: "Liverpool's transfer committee, and Jürgen Klopp, have been lauded more than any scouting network in world football. This is on them. One midfield player signed in 4 and a half years. They are running on fumes." (Sky)

The fact there's still a massive Gini Wijnaldum shaped hole in our midfield is absolutely astonishing really.

You'll win nothing with a non functional midfield.

Ox and Keita need to go asap. Fabinho is woeful for months now. Milner should be retired, and Hendo is slowing down big time.

Massive overhaul needed. No point having an abundance of attackers with nothing behind them to support.

This. However, Kieta did play well today. Don't bank on him being fit tomorrow, but what he did show you was that with control in the middle of the park, we can play our style of football. So get a MFer who can do that consistently. Elliot, Carvalho, and Barjetic aren't there yet. Jones, Milner, Ox, and Naby aren't good enough. Hendo is a great option to see games out, nothing more. Tell some hard truths and spend some money where we really need it.

JK needs to wake up and see things for what they really are. We are what we are atm, so coach to that and not what we were 3 seasons ago. 4-4-2. 4-3-2-1. Play a back 3 if you have to for God's sake. We don't have the players to play our normal system.

Love Bobby to death, but signing him is a mistake, we need to get younger and quicker. He's an amazing player and club servant, but he does nothing for either of those needs.

Gutted - again.
I know it's pantomime season but FFS.
Truly terrible in all depts really. I don't really see what Gakpo is going to bring to this team - he must be wondering WTF he is doing here. 
All this ticky tacky sidewards backwards sidewards is absolutely doing my head in - no quick incisive passing and certainly no muscle in the middle. What happened to our press? (The ball not the journos)
We've got defenders who can't/don't defend. A midfield which doesn't know what tackling/pressing/attacking/defending is and a front line that don't know where the net is and when they see it they can't score.
And I am not trying to put Nunez down at all - but he needs to learn to stay onside first never mind find the sodding net.
There are so many simply not good enough it's completely pointless trying to list them all but the worst for me tonight was the sight of the brick lav otherwise known as Ibou falling on his face when he should have been the proverbial brick lav wall. 
TV saying VVD sat with an ice pack on? We're also now being linked with some Wolves midfielder Nunes who wait for it - we were interested in last summer and hasn't had many minutes this year cos..... he's been injured   And we can't wait till the summer - we need a midfield engine now. Because this team tonight doesn't even look up to the challenge of the Europa nevr mind the CL.
Goodbye Top 4 and Goodbye to any million pound signings - cos no World Class player is going to want to come here.

Can Jürgen not see that the system that was so successful is now killing us. The high line, the midfield and forward press; these tactics worked with players of a certain age who were strong and fast. But sadly a lot of those same players have aged* They have now lost that pace and the stamina needed, and simply can not, can not, do what they once did....there might be the odd glimpse of it, but not for whole games.
So what do we do?...Short term: We can't change the whole playing personnel, so a change of tactic HAS to happen. If we don't change tack and continue with this high line we will continue to ship goals and won't be able to compete at the top of the division. Long term: if JK want's to continue to play this system, then younger, fitter players will be needed.
* They are not too old per se...just too old for this system.

Today had little to do with the system

Konate, reminded me of the old days of jimmy traore, he cost us 2 goals

Lack of intensity in corners, from the keeper too, when we are on the ropes with corners, come out and punch the fckn ball and knock out anyone in the way

The 2nd goal, again corner and then Elliott tries a dummy after we try to break, slow the game down, but we go gung ho

I do agree we should be changing things but it’s clear we are a team that is broken

We badly badly need legs in midfield, we cannot play with intense teams anymore, it’s clear, but when we get jota back and can rotate a bit, it will help a lot as well as the new boy, so can at least press teams better and have fresh players

So many issues, ageing midfield and injuries up front means we cannot press high, so we are sitting ducks for teams to break our line

The fact there's still a massive Gini Wijnaldum shaped hole in our midfield is absolutely astonishing really.

I don’t think it’s down to running on fumes.
Teams know how to play against us.
We could have mascherano Alonso and gerrard in midfield but the fact is we play with such stacking full backs and a high line that we can’t offer the protection we need.

But this one player in four years so they must be shattered doesn’t make sense. Whoever we buy has been playing for those four years as well. It’s not like Bellingham has been in a coma for four years and will be any more fresh than Fabinho.

Carragher: "Liverpool's transfer committee, and Jürgen Klopp, have been lauded more than any scouting network in world football. This is on them. One midfield player signed in 4 and a half years. They are running on fumes." (Sky)

Pretty wild when you think of it

Brentford has shown that you don’t need big names to win a match. There were more dedicated and hungry for the win, whereas we were casual and played like it was a training match. We are not Brentford, we need more big name signings.

Garbage reds utter garbage, get it fixed now.

There now needs to be a "none of the above" option for MoM. I won't be giving anyone it tonight.

I don’t think it’s down to running on fumes.
Teams know how to play against us.
We could have mascherano Alonso and gerrard in midfield but the fact is we play with such stacking full backs and a high line that we can’t offer the protection we need.

But this one player in four years so they must be shattered doesn’t make sense. Whoever we buy has been playing for those four years as well. It’s not like Bellingham has been in a coma for four years and will be any more fresh than Fabinho.

The issue is teams play through us, we don’t hunt the ball down and stop other teams from playing, and I mean in the respect of when they play in our half

We need midfield players that can cover the full backs like they used to do. The current crop can only do it for small parts of a game before again they run on empty and get out worked and fought

Just look at the three games we lost against Leeds, Brentford and forest, we were out fought and run, that’s how they beat us

I don’t understand why we are not bringing in a couple of cm with Legs, the Leicester player could be one, our midfield isn’t very very average in terms of work rate, right now, a momo sissoko like player which isn’t hard to find would improve us

Problems in a jar are…

TAA is targeted every game and his defensive frailties show.

VVD has been in decline since Pickford.

Gomez hasn’t improved enough to be a first teamer.

Matip is getting to that age now and has one too many injuries in his baggage.

Keita and Ox miss too many games.

Henderson is becoming Too hit or miss and getting on in years.

Thiago can control a match but he’s One sprint away from injury.

Fabinho hasn’t looked up to speed in months and months.

Jones and Elliott have much to learn and improve before they can be relied on.

Salah hasn’t been the same since Egypt failed to qualify. A few good games and then he disappears for weeks.

Diaz and jota obviously injured but are decent options to have.

Bobby has offered little in quite some time now. Doesn’t seem to fit as he did in that salah bobby mane trio.

Nunez misses sitters.

Gutted - again.
I know it's pantomime season but FFS.
Truly terrible in all depts really. I don't really see what Gakpo is going to bring to this team - he must be wondering WTF he is doing here. 
All this ticky tacky sidewards backwards sidewards is absolutely doing my head in - no quick incisive passing and certainly no muscle in the middle. What happened to our press? (The ball not the journos)
We've got defenders who can't/don't defend. A midfield which doesn't know what tackling/pressing/attacking/defending is and a front line that don't know where the net is and when they see it they can't score.
And I am not trying to put Nunez down at all - but he needs to learn to stay onside first never mind find the sodding net.
There are so many simply not good enough it's completely pointless trying to list them all but the worst for me tonight was the sight of the brick lav otherwise known as Ibou falling on his face when he should have been the proverbial brick lav wall. 
TV saying VVD sat with an ice pack on? We're also now being linked with some Wolves midfielder Nunes who wait for it - we were interested in last summer and hasn't had many minutes this year cos..... he's been injured   And we can't wait till the summer - we need a midfield engine now. Because this team tonight doesn't even look up to the challenge of the Europa nevr mind the CL.
Goodbye Top 4 and Goodbye to any million pound signings - cos no World Class player is going to want to come here.

With regards Nunes he has played 14 out of 17 league games this season

Can Jürgen not see that the system that was so successful is now killing us. The high line, the midfield and forward press; these tactics worked with players of a certain age who were strong and fast. But sadly a lot of those same players have aged* They have now lost that pace and the stamina needed, and simply can not, can not, do what they once did....there might be the odd glimpse of it, but not for whole games.
So what do we do?...Short term: We can't change the whole playing personnel, so a change of tactic HAS to happen. If we don't change tack and continue with this high line we will continue to ship goals and won't be able to compete at the top of the division. Long term: if JK want's to continue to play this system, then younger, fitter players will be needed.
* They are not too old per se...just too old for this system.

I agree with you. But is that not also an argument why Klopp's system becomes obsolete? It is too demanding! Klopp's pressing only works 2 years then the whole team needs an overhaul.

Problems in a jar are…

TAA is targeted every game and his defensive frailties show.

VVD has been in decline since Pickford.

Gomez hasn’t improved enough to be a first teamer.

Matip is getting to that age now and has one too many injuries in his baggage.

Keita and Ox miss too many games.

Henderson is becoming Too hit or miss and getting on in years.

Thiago can control a match but he’s One sprint away from injury.

Fabinho hasn’t looked up to speed in months and months.

Jones and Elliott have much to learn and improve before they can be relied on.

Salah hasn’t been the same since Egypt failed to qualify. A few good games and then he disappears for weeks.

Diaz and jota obviously injured but are decent options to have.

Bobby has offered little in quite some time now. Doesn’t seem to fit as he did in that salah bobby mane trio.

Nunez misses sitters.

But other than that we’re ok?

The fact there's still a massive Gini Wijnaldum shaped hole in our midfield is absolutely astonishing really.

Quite astonishing we could have brought him back for a low fee or on loan in the Summer to bolster the midfield .... yet we cut off our nose blah blah blah and did FA. He was a ready made player, reliable, consistent, knew the club inside out and the lads would have loved to see him back. That's not hindsight ... that's just common sense and bringing in what you can/the best you can on a next to nothing budget.

But we brought f*cking melo in instead on loan. Unfit , overweight and in no condition to play when he arrived. A f*cking shambles.

Brentford has shown that you don’t need big names to win a match. There were more dedicated and hungry for the win, whereas we were casual and played like it was a training match. We are not Brentford, we need more big name signings.

No. We tried hard. But our midfield is not creative enough to give our strikers these 2-4 more good opportunities above what we get anyway, and our midfield not strong enough to regain lost balls and intercept counter attacks to serve as a first layer of defense to make it much easier for our actual defense. Klopp needs either a midfield magician who lets our strikers shine more often or one/two midfield Rambos like Fab/Hendo 2019/2020 or he needs to play less high line and ball possessive, i.e. more like Atletico, less like City. It's easy but Jürgen is no rocket scientist and Buvac is not here anymore to help him out.

Quite astonishing we could have brought him back for a low fee or on loan in the Summer to bolster the midfield .... yet we cut off our nose blah blah blah and did FA. He was a ready made player, reliable, consistent, knew the club inside out and the lads would have loved to see him back. That's not hindsight ... that's just common sense and bringing in what you can/the best you can on a next to nothing budget.

But we brought f*cking melo in instead on loan. Unfit , overweight and in no condition to play when he arrived. A f*cking shambles.

Why would Klopp bring back a player who turned down the club for a big wage ?

But other than that we’re ok?

I don’t think we are a million light years away…. But we are drifting in the wrong direction

I don't care if we get top 4 or not. The most important thing is to get rid of the FSG this year so we can start the season with new owners.

Can Jürgen not see that the system that was so successful is now killing us. The high line, the midfield and forward press; these tactics worked with players of a certain age who were strong and fast. But sadly a lot of those same players have aged* They have now lost that pace and the stamina needed, and simply can not, can not, do what they once did....there might be the odd glimpse of it, but not for whole games.
So what do we do?...Short term: We can't change the whole playing personnel, so a change of tactic HAS to happen. If we don't change tack and continue with this high line we will continue to ship goals and won't be able to compete at the top of the division. Long term: if JK want's to continue to play this system, then younger, fitter players will be needed.
* They are not too old per se...just too old for this system.

Sadly have to agree. Our struggle to adapt this season has shown itself once more when we don't have the personnel to play the way we used to. I think this is one of the manager's weaknesses. Transition or no transition (we are gonna be called the trannies before long) we should be doing better with the players we have. Maybe not top of the table but certainly a good 6 points better off than we are.

I don't care if we get top 4 or not. The most important thing is to get rid of the FSG this year so we can start the season with new owners.

Who do you have in mind and what difference will they make to the current way we play ?

Disappointing performance to say the least, Brentford deserved their win. Where do we go from here f**k knows. Simply glad I am not in Jürgen's shoes atm.