Maxi (Newells Old Boys)

Like I said it is all about opinions, but in my opinion the two games that gave me hope that Kenny and Co were changing the philosophy were United at home and Fulham away. Both games ( take away the goals of Maxi at Fulham ) Maxi played his part in the best football our team has played in many a year.

I am getting old but I seem to remember Maxi played well at Chelsea but was caught up in trying to get forward to much instead of defending a lead in the later part of the match. Hence we took him off for Aurelio.

vs Chelsea, Maxi almost gave 2 goals to them (one was a brilliant assist to Torres, thankfully he isn't the same in blue), and missed a sitter I could've scored (seriously).

The thing about Maxi is that he can get involved in a brilliant play without ruining it (a short simple passing, for example) but his contribution is hardly mouth watering. As I said, that is a quality of course, but it's very often made look like if he was the genius behind the play in question. He's rarely the one who actually create something out of nowhere, like Suarez, or even Meireles, can do. The real creative players get the engine running (vs Chelsea, Meireles and Lucas were fantastic), while Maxi is a supporting act at best. In this particular game, though, he did what he usually doesn't, and as I said almost gave away 2 goals. Terrible.

Should get rid of Pepe, Agger and Kuyt too, after all they're products of the previous regime too.
He's a clever footballer, he's not flashy sure.  Him scoring 10 goals would seem to indicate, you're talking sh*t.
He's not particularly good at beating his man, true.
His link up play is brilliant and you failing to recognise this pretty much confirms you are talking sh*t.
His wages aren't a problem.
You even admit he's played well under Kenny and then say we should get rid, you'd be better off applying for a job at Real Madrid or Chelsea.  Jorge Valdano just got fired, perhaps you could take his job of picking random players and telling them they're transfer listed to make room for new galacticos.

For the last time, SQUAD OPTION.

The first bold quoted sentence is pathetic at best. What does that have to do with my opinion on Maxi?. Absolutely nothing.

After that comment you accuse me of talking sh*t?. We really have been watching a different Maxi. His link up play is terrible and he has terrible ball control, in my opinion. I said he's had a minescule purple patch under Kenny, he is nowhere near the quality of player we need in our squad.

I have to say, when people claim Maxi is versatile I do have to rub my eyes in disbelief. Again this is just my opinion based on watching a very dire footballer with no definitive attributes at all.

He scored a hat trick on the right, represented Argentina in the centre of park in a World Cup, scored a hat trick on the left, and played just off Aguero and Forlan at Atletico Madrid.

It's not just saying he has played there, he's done so effectively at the highest level. Versatility to me.

For me Maxi has been almost anonymous in most of his games for us. Yes his goals have papered over the cracks a little, but not enough in my opinion to be too concerned if he wants to go. Hopefully once we have brought in the new boys and waved goodbye to some of the dross/bitpart /surplus to requirement players we will have a squad with few weaknesses and no place for the anonymous/average jack of all trades masters of none such as Maxi.

If we have any intention of challenging for the title we must be able to call upon better squad players than this when the need arises.   

He scored a hat trick on the right, represented Argentina in the centre of park in a World Cup, scored a hat trick on the left, and played just off Aguero and Forlan at Atletico Madrid.

It's not just saying he has played there, he's done so effectively at the highest level. Versatility to me.

Oh, what a surprise. Crouchy using old news to justify his opinion. While you're at it, why don't you chuck some YouTube videos up for us to marvel at in his glory years?. Take those 2 hat tricks out of the equation and what is left?, a couple of YouTube videos. Yawn.

Maxi is not versatile in my opinion and i can't believe that people want to keep him here based on his performances this season.

The first bold quoted sentence is pathetic at best. What does that have to do with my opinion on Maxi?. Absolutely nothing.

After that comment you accuse me of talking sh*t?. We really have been watching a different Maxi. His link up play is terrible and he has terrible ball control, in my opinion. I said he's had a minescule purple patch under Kenny, he is nowhere near the quality of player we need in our squad.

I have to say, when people claim Maxi is versatile I do have to rub my eyes in disbelief. Again this is just my opinion based on watching a very dire footballer with no definitive attributes at all.

Fair point.  Unaware or ignorant of surroundings would have been a better term to use.  Just because he doesn't dribble around players and make explosive runs throwing tricks in left, right and centre people think that it's simply impossible he could be a winger.  Maxi's not thick, he realises his limitations.  He can't be that type of guy, so he focuses on link up play and smart movement.  Yossi was another classic example, people used to say he was average, too small etc.  When the reality was, he was one of our better players.  

I don't think Maxi is one of our better players, but he's good and there's aspects of his game which make him worth keeping around.  His link up play is quality, his ball control is very good and I'd completely agree with you about us watching a different Maxi.  You're watching Maxi when he gets the ball and when he doesn't produce something magical you berate him for it.  I'm watching the Maxi that doesn't have the ball and makes the clever run which allows his teammate (who can do something magical) the space to do that something magical.

He is versatile, he was a RM who was converted to a LM, had no problems with it and just got about doing his business - it didn't stifle his game, nobody ever suggests that Maxi can't play on a particular wing (not that it's the best example but Gerrard simply sucks at LW, granted he can play RW quite well and of course more central - but with Maxi it's not true, he plays both decently).  It's a good trait to have for a squad player.  

Again, your opinion based on watching a very dire footballer with no definitve attributes at all is more a reflection of you and how you look at fooball than Maxi's perceived lack of ability.  Like I said, if you believe he is not of sufficient quality to be in our squad, there's a position available for you as Real Madrid's sporting director where you can pick and choose galacticos at random to fill the squad because, heaven forbid, the 7th choice winger isn't world class or is suffering a purple patch or not selling enough jerseys.

For the record, you said "he was playing well" under Kenny, not that "he had a purple patch".  Doesn't matter at Real Madrid though, common sense isn't required.  I like how you've already backtracked on more than half of the reasons for getting rid of him though in one post though.

I have to say that I'm a bit of a fan of Maxi.

Not for his couple of hat tricks.

But because he makes very intelligent runs, passes well, creates space, hustles & harries, and generally makes a nuisance of himself, allowing the FB to get in.

He can also play nice one touch stuff.

A bit like Raul really - both good pro's, both have their defincencies, both solid squad members, both could offer more.

By the way, Maxi is one of the best genuine pass-and-move players on this LFC team ...

By the way, Maxi is one of the best genuine pass-and-move player on this LFC team ...

So is Lucas and so is Aquilani

Not to mention suarez, and flanagan.

Good players look for the pass if one is not immediately on - bad players try to force it.

So is Lucas and so is Aquilani

True ... That is why I would love to see all three of them on our squad next season ...

I don't even think Maxi is off, apparently them quotes were taken out of context, he wants another season in England. 

I don't even think Maxi is off, apparently them quotes were taken out of context, he wants another season in England. 

Damn.

True ... That is why I would love to see all three of them on our squad next season ...

It's not a barca fixation, it's a desire to see our team play the type of football we want to see, and perhaps more importantly, see the players doing their best.

Instead of watching poulsen with his pursed mouth wondering why he has been skinned again, just like konchesky.

In comparison to the sh*te hodgson bought, Maxi was an inspired signing.

Fair point.  Unaware or ignorant of surroundings would have been a better term to use.  Just because he doesn't dribble around players and make explosive runs throwing tricks in left, right and centre people think that it's simply impossible he could be a winger.  Maxi's not thick, he realises his limitations.  He can't be that type of guy, so he focuses on link up play and smart movement.  Yossi was another classic example, people used to say he was average, too small etc.  When the reality was, he was one of our better players.  

I don't think Maxi is one of our better players, but he's good and there's aspects of his game which make him worth keeping around.  His link up play is quality, his ball control is very good and I'd completely agree with you about us watching a different Maxi.  You're watching Maxi when he gets the ball and when he doesn't produce something magical you berate him for it.  I'm watching the Maxi that doesn't have the ball and makes the clever run which allows his teammate (who can do something magical) the space to do that something magical.

He is versatile, he was a RM who was converted to a LM, had no problems with it and just got about doing his business - it didn't stifle his game, nobody ever suggests that Maxi can't play on a particular wing (not that it's the best example but Gerrard simply sucks at LW, granted he can play RW quite well and of course more central - but with Maxi it's not true, he plays both decently).  It's a good trait to have for a squad player.  

Again, your opinion based on watching a very dire footballer with no definitve attributes at all is more a reflection of you and how you look at fooball than Maxi's perceived lack of ability.  Like I said, if you believe he is not of sufficient quality to be in our squad, there's a position available for you as Real Madrid's sporting director where you can pick and choose galacticos at random to fill the squad because, heaven forbid, the 7th choice winger isn't world class or is suffering a purple patch or not selling enough jerseys.

For the record, you said "he was playing well" under Kenny, not that "he had a purple patch".  Doesn't matter at Real Madrid though, common sense isn't required.  I like how you've already backtracked on more than half of the reasons for getting rid of him though in one post though.

Listen sir, I've been watching Liverpool since 1981 and I'm quite a good judge of what type of player makes the grade at Liverpool, Maxi doesn't in my opinion. I think his ball control is very poor and his link up play is below average for a Liverpool player.

My opinion is not based on how I look at football, it's how I look at Maxi. Just because he's had a good spell under Kenny doesn't mean I rate the lad. Our opinions differ but I will not stoop to your childish depths and make sarcastic managerial comments about you as that would just be rising to your bait.

In all honesty I have not questioned your knowledge of football during this debate or any other, yet you chose to question mine, I wonder why that was?.

Jog on.

I think Maxi's linkup play is excellent, probably the one part of his game I really fancy.

I don't even think Maxi is off, apparently them quotes were taken out of context, he wants another season in England.  

Which was how I interpreted it when I first read the OP, then work got in the way, then a cycle home. Can't believe this then got to four pages.... I forgot, tis the silly season.  

Listen sir, I've been watching Liverpool since 1981 and I'm quite a good judge of what type of player makes the grade at Liverpool, Maxi doesn't in my opinion. I think his ball control is very poor and his link up play is below average for a Liverpool player.

My opinion is not based on how I look at football, it's how I look at Maxi. Just because he's had a good spell under Kenny doesn't mean I rate the lad. Our opinions differ but I will not stoop to your childish depths and make sarcastic managerial comments about you as that would just be rising to your bait.

In all honesty I have not questioned your knowledge of football during this debate or any other, yet you chose to question mine, I wonder why that was?.

Jog on.

I just made vanilla and pear flavoured porridge for breakfast which makes me equally as qualified to be a good judge of character of who will make the grade at Liverpool.  If you're confused, the point I'm making is that how long you've been watching Liverpool doesn't qualify you any better to make a decision about who will make the grade here or not.  If you truthfully believe it does, then I would have been spot on in my assessment of you.  

You state the reasoning that he's a product of the previous regime and then dismiss my claims that so were Agger, Kuyt and Reina too as rubbish.  You're spot on, it is rubbish.  I only used that example so it would be clear to you how stupid saying something like that was.  

You then ask what's that got to do with your opinion on Maxi, nothing - but proceed to mention that you've been watching Liverpool since the 1980s again and act as if that's some defining factor in deciding what constitutes a Liverpool player.  Liverpool have had many unspectacular players over the years, it's not about who has the most "best players" it's about who has the best team.

If he's had a "good spell" under Kenny, why is it so out of the realms of possibility that he could keep it going.  As for my alleged football knowledge, you should be questioning it, because if it or the logic that I have used to reach my conclusions is wrong - it should be up for scrutiny.

Saying Maxi is not versatile is wrong.  He can play comfortably in a number of positions.
Saying Maxi is very dire is wrong.  The fact you believe he's "very dire" instead of "not quite good enough" leads me to believe you're on a genuine crusade against him.
Saying Maxi has no "definitive attributes" again is probably helping my argument more about this is genuinely about "how you see football" rather that it being a case of "Maxi having no definite attributes".

Quality little snide remark at the end though, but I'm pleased you wouldn't stoop to such "childish depths" and "sarcastic managerial comments" because you're above all that.  I may be am a c**t but I don't pretend I'm above it.  I'm off for a jog now.

Quite happy if he stays but won't lose too much sleep if he goes. I kinda figured most Reds would have similar feelings tbh but that doesn't entirely seem to be the case given the passion in this thread! For me he's an intelligent player, good passer of the ball, clever moevment, and clearly it's taken him a bit of time to get up to the speed of English football. His workrate is pretty good as well, i've seen him mark, track and tackle in most games. Has to play in a team with good movement and lots of players showing for the ball, giving good angles etc in order to be effective and that is exactly how we wplayed for a couple of months under Kenny at the back end of the year. He's never gonna dazzle with skills, or blind people with his pace but he's proved he can contribute and be a useful player. On the flip side, he is also quite replacable should he be allowed to leave. I'm fairly indifferent tbh.

You really are one arrogant, hatefull c**t. This is a fans forum. If you want to show off your big words and your so called 'knowledge' of football, F**k off somewhere else. No one gives a toss on here

Arrogant, yes.  Hateful, no.  c**t, yes.  Thanks for contributing to the discussion

emile heskey has a similar sort of career too. still sh*te though.

maxi is inconsistent and just because he bagged a couple of hat tricks towards the end of last season doesn't mean we should be making him out for more than what he is.

he is a squad player. nothing more.

if we are serious about challenging for the league next season then id want better quality than maxi on the wings.

happy for him to stay by all means and play in a squad role but thats as far as it goes for me.

100% agree. wouldnt care if he left

By the way, Maxi is one of the best genuine pass-and-move players on this LFC team ...

Agree. Good passer of the ball and very intelligent movement and like someone above said he also has an excellent work rate. Also chips in with a few goals and 10 in 28 league games this season is pretty good.

His statement to the Argentine media was on the 10th June, a couple of days before this big charity game.

Could have been a bit of arse kissing.  Who knows.

Either way - he's unlikely to be a first XI player but I'd be happy if he stayed.

castrolfootball.com says he is the 21st best player in the world, he is our best player apparently. He has been ranked our highest player for most of the second half of the season. (Throwing cat among the pigeons, he he)

I was shocked by this and was joking with a mate saying "They obviously don't have a stat for crapping yourself in front of goal". He seems over that now, so I would not be inclined to let him go. Also Kun won't want him to go either.