Stewart Downing (West Ham/Newcastle)

Hopefully we can get a deal hammered out, especially for a player who's career here has never really been on the bubble.

Sam Allardyce.

Kop legend.

Please be true! To be honest I don't care where he goes so long as he isn't a Liverpool player next season!

This would be like Christmas.  Carroll out, Downing out, all we need now is someone to place a halfway decent bid for Jordan "I was slightly less sh*te in my second season" Henderson and we'll be well on our way.

This would be like Christmas.  Kenny out, Comolli out, Adam out, Carroll out, Downing out, Suarez almost out & all we need now is someone to place a halfway decent bid for Jordan "I was slightly less sh*te in my second season" Henderson and we'll be well on our way.

Kenny & his team never existed did they?.

Kenny & his team never existed did they?.

They did and aside from Suarez and Bellamy they set our on the pitch team back about ten years.  We had a massive, one time cash injection of £100m plus from the owners, and they spent it on Carroll, Henderson, Downing, Coates, Adam, etc.  That's money we're never going to get back.  They got it wrong.  End of.

It's a shame we can't put some "supporters" on the transfer list...

On topic though, any other players we don't want to keep that we can offer West Ham at the same time, saves them constantly coming back.

He did improve from Christmas on but lets be fair.. he couldn't have got much worse.

Decent player but not good enough if we want to be pushing for the top places again!

They did and aside from Suarez and Bellamy they set our on the pitch team back about ten years.  We had a massive, one time cash injection of £100m plus from the owners, and they spent it on Carroll, Henderson, Downing, Coates, Adam, etc.  That's money we're never going to get back.  They got it wrong.  End of.

No, owners set us back 10 years & the sh*te Kenny bought delivered us a Trophy something Rodgers has failed thus far yet Kenny was out the game 20 years & got 1,

No, owners set us back 10 years & the sh*te Kenny bought delivered us a Trophy something Rodgers has failed thus far yet Kenny was out the game 20 years & got 1,

Hurrrrrray, the "Carling" Cup, valued so much by the big clubs that they played their second strings in order to focus on the league, the "Carling" Cup, where we nearly lost to a CHAMPIONSHIP side and barely scraped through on penalties.  Ok.  We have another trophy.  The "Carling" Cup.  The problem is, we were never trying to win those cups before Kenny came in, so it's not like he pulled us over the finish line where we had never done it before.  What matters is winning the League, and, if you can, winning the Champions League.  Ask Birmingham a few years ago whether they would have won the Carling Cup or stayed in the league. 

Kenny is, along with Shankly, the greatest figure in the history of Liverpool Football Club.  But you're not a "supporter" if you think that he's infallible.  He made mistakes, along with Comolli, in his signings, he would be the first to admit it.  You seem to think that by calling our sh*te players good you're somehow "supporting," you're really not, 1) they don't even know you exist and 2) the CLUB's success is what is important, and the club has no way to succeed by having a conveyor belt of sh*te players coming in and out of the club.

i for one don't think he is sh*t as most people seem to think. I just had a problem with how much we paid to get him. He's a good squad player to have in the team.I'll rather keep him than sell him for 6 million cos i guess an average squad player would cost that.

And since most of us here say he improved over the course of the 2nd half of the season nothing stops that from continuing in the new season.

I'm indifferent if he goes or stays but if we do sell it has to be at the right price. 6 million is too small for Downing in my opinion.

He made mistakes, along with Comolli, in his signings, he would be the first to admit it.

I don't personally believe he would admit any of the signings were a mistake because he has a mentality of not representing someone in a bad light. While I agree some of his signings weren't of the standard I would like the 'value' of the signings actually haven't been bad at all. What happens is every time people talk about the signings they simply say Carroll, Downing, Henderson and immediately the argument is null and void in my view.

Kenny and Steve Clarke have both said that they thought they could take those signings on to another level this year and while some choose to give Brendan the credit for 'getting the best out of' Henderson or Downing but also give him the benefit of the 'first year teething problems' with Allen and Borini.

The truth as nearly always is somewhere in the middle, Kenny had more faith in Henderson than Brendan and the lad's biggest weakness was his confidence, if the greatest Liverpool player in history giving you his backing doesn't give you confidence while playing for Liverpool then I'm sorry there's little any psychologist could do for you. The same with Downing, while I personally can't stand the player, Kenny played him constantly and showed tremendous faith in him. So I don't personally buy into the argument that Brendan, in showing these guys towards the exit door and trying to package Henderson into a deal out of the club 'got the best out of them'. I feel first season settling in, a massive transition in the Summer and many other factors were actually involved in their so called improved form this year. (I buy Henderson's improvement, I'm not nearly close to sold on the Downing debate.)

So no, I think you'd very much struggle in getting to admit any of his purchases were a 'mistake' as I don't think he's the type of man who would tar someone else with that label.

Hurrrrrray, the "Carling" Cup, valued so much by the big clubs that they played their second strings in order to focus on the league, the "Carling" Cup, where we nearly lost to a CHAMPIONSHIP side and barely scraped through on penalties.  Ok.  We have another trophy.  The "Carling" Cup.  The problem is, we were never trying to win those cups before Kenny came in, so it's not like he pulled us over the finish line where we had never done it before.  What matters is winning the League, and, if you can, winning the Champions League.  Ask Birmingham a few years ago whether they would have won the Carling Cup or stayed in the league. 

Kenny is, along with Shankly, the greatest figure in the history of Liverpool Football Club.  But you're not a "supporter" if you think that he's infallible.  He made mistakes, along with Comolli, in his signings, he would be the first to admit it.  You seem to think that by calling our sh*te players good you're somehow "supporting," you're really not, 1) they don't even know you exist and 2) the CLUB's success is what is important, and the club has no way to succeed by having a conveyor belt of sh*te players coming in and out of the club.

Firstly, neither Chelsea nor City played their 2nd 11 against us and secondly, I don't think Kenny would say he made mistakes with his signings. 

He bought players to fit his system, the same as every manager does.  We may have paid over the odds for them and we may not have had the results he expected but he's not the first manager that's happened to and he won't be the last.

Downing to ground control.

Shouldn't this be a joyous thread and not one descending into a debate about Dalglish?

Never rated Downing. Was pretty gutted when Kenny signed him. Will be happy to see him leave. Not much of a player, not much of a winning attitude and shits out of tackles too easily.

Downing to ground control.

Shouldn't this be a joyous thread and not one descending into a debate about Dalglish?

Never rated Downing. Was pretty gutted when Kenny signed him. Will be happy to see him leave. Not much of a player, not much of a winning attitude and shits out of tackles too easily.

Sorry mate but I don't believe any manager knowingly buys players to be sh*te.

I don't believe any manager knowingly buys players to be sh*te.

Of course they don't Debs. Any such statement isn't worth wasting your time on mate.

But what is interesting is whether some managers/DOF's go for playing ability alone or look a bit deeper into a players attitude towards the game. For me, I was gutted when we signed Downing and the main reason wasn't because of how he was ability wise. It was down to him going missing far too often in games. I was surprised we were linked with him under Rafa and I was surprised we signed him under the King. I suppose it must have been down to the fact he was English and maybe a foreign winger/midfielder would have been more expensive in this case. Who knows.

Of course they don't Debs. Any such statement isn't worth wasting your time on mate.

But what is interesting is whether some managers/DOF's go for playing ability alone or look a bit deeper into a players attitude towards the game. For me, I was gutted when we signed Downing and the main reason wasn't because of how he was ability wise. It was down to him going missing far too often in games. I was surprised we were linked with him under Rafa and I was surprised we signed him under the King. I suppose it must have been down to the fact he was English and maybe a foreign winger/midfielder would have been more expensive in this case. Who knows.

I agree Kenny, I think most of our signings at that time were based on their playing stats more than anything else.  With regards to Downing, he's an insipid individual with about as much charisma, character and fight as a blade of grass.

Has he gone yet ?

With regards to Downing, he's an insipid individual with about as much charisma, character and fight as a blade of grass.

Agree 100% mate.  He should have been shipped out last summer.  When you get the chance to play for Liverpool Football Club, you better give every single ounce of energy and fight you have, especially if you're not the most talented, like Downing. 

Instead of doing that, in his first season he was continually jogging around, airmailing crosses, whining about other players, refusing to take anyone on, walking instead of running, shitting out of tackles, just showing such disrespect to the shirt and the club and to Kenny who signed him.  The idea that someone says "ok, you didn't care your first season, but we'll give you another season to show you care" is ridiculous.  If you don't even put in the effort from Day 1, then you don't deserve to be here. 

Some forget how little effort he put in his first season.  Anyone remember Bolton away in January of 2011?  he came on for Charlie Adam in the second half and just walked around for the next 30 minutes.  Most infuriating performance I've seen from any Liverpool player in years.  We were down 3-1 and he just walked around and didn't want the ball.

Get rid of him.  Don't even give me this bollocks about "supporting" the players.  If they don't show respect to the club and to the shirt then they don't deserve our support.

With regards to Downing, he's an insipid individual with about as much charisma, character and fight as a blade of grass.

 

Love the blunt and honest nature of this!

I love a bit of personality in every player and sadly I think you are right in that he is something of an archetype football figure in the same way that people like Wayne Rooney and Rio Ferdinand (who tries to be a "personality" but comes of as a complete dick) are. Devoid of any personality at all. Maybe they are not like that and they are all hilarious and wacky individuals but people like that would probably be on my dinner guests from hell. I wouldn't serve alcohol either because they're probably dick head drunks. In fact if I had to cook dinner for them I would serve them ice cubes with sugar on them with a glass of water.

Sorry it's getting late.

How many English players do we need in the squad. Jonjo and Carroll are both gone, can we sell Downing and meet the quota?

 You can start the abuse if you feel so lads,but I would not sell Downing (for that figure anyway).Not that I think he´s class but is quite versatile,a good squad player.We already got rid of Shelvey making another mistake imo.

Have to agree
Wouldn't sell for the sake of it.
At times he has proved useful and when his confidence returned he was quite productive BUT not when related to the amount he cost
Fact is we have him. Yes his wages are too high and yes there are other players we should purchased instead of but he is here and can be a useful option when needed.

If someone comes in with a good offer...about 8 million and up then fine, sell and reinvest. If not I would keep him.