Graeme (Bitter and) Sour-ness thread

Souness: Only the Liverpool fans are saving Rafa

Former Liverpool boss Graeme Souness believes that only the loyalty of the club's fans has saved Rafa Benitez from the sack.

The Anfield legend, who also enjoyed a distinguished playing career on Merseyside, is adamant that had the current Reds boss been at any other top club, he would have been shown the door by now.

Benitez endured another desperate blow this week in what is fast turning into a nightmare season, when his injury ravaged side conceded a stoppage time goal against Lyon that has put them on the brink of a Champions League exit.

Souness, who is one of the current Liverpool manager's most vociferous critics, believes the malaise runs deeper, and he argued Benitez has made too many mistakes to be immune from the most rigorous of scrutiny.

"My criticism is what I've mentioned before. I think he's been there five years, and spent more money than anybody else other than Chelsea," Souness told Sky Sports.

"What I can tell you is that if Rafa had been at any other club, any other big club, whether it be Arsenal, Man United or Chelsea, he wouldn't be there because I don't think the supporters at those clubs are like Liverpool supporters.

"I think Liverpool fans will be a bit more patient and give a manager a bit more time."

Souness though, believes that time is fast running out for the Liverpool boss, especially after what he saw as a sub-standard performance in Lyon.

The former Reds captain, who won three European Cups at Anfield, was unimpressed with the draw in France that leaves the English club requiring a miracle - in the words of their manager - to reach the knockout stage of the Champions League.

Benitez believes the fates are currently conspiring against him, with 14 players struck down by illness and injury in the past week.

But Souness added: "Injuries are part of the game, especially when you get to November time. That's when they kick in generally.

"I think what's behind the first XI isn't good enough to go and win games like that in Lyon.

"Lyon aren't a great team. Lyon won at Anfield then lost 4-1 at Nice in the next game they played."

Mirror Football.

God sake that is now 2 a piece that him and Whelan have taken a pop at Rafa.

You wouldn't think these were Ex-Reds the way they are hammering us.

End of the day Graeme, Rafa is ten times the manager you were, so jog on.

Sour grapes from someone who went from being a legendary player to almost destroying the club as a manager.

Learned a long time ago not listen to anything Souness comes out with. Tw*t

Former Liverpool boss Graeme Souness believes that only the loyalty of the club's fans has saved Rafa Benitez from the sack.

Might also be something to do with the fact the owners can not afford 20 million to sack him or maybe just maybe Graeme they see they continuity as the key the key to success have you ever thought of that ?

The Anfield legend, who also enjoyed a distinguished playing career on Merseyside, is adamant that had the current Reds boss been at any other top club, he would have been shown the door by now.

How long was it before Fergie won the League with Man United yet the board stuck by him ?, bearing in mind Fergie had not been to European Cup finals winning one of them and an Fa cup triumph in that time either.

Benitez endured another desperate blow this week in what is fast turning into a nightmare season, when his injury ravaged side conceded a stoppage time goal against Lyon that has put them on the brink of a Champions League exit.

Souness, who is one of the current Liverpool manager's most vociferous critics, believes the malaise runs deeper, and he argued Benitez has made too many mistakes to be immune from the most rigorous of scrutiny.

He's not exempt from any scrutiny at all, just like you as Liverpool manager Graham, he's made some shocking signings, how ever you took over the most successful club in england at the pinacle of its success with the full backing of the board, you could have signed any world star yet you gave us Julian Dicks & Mark Walters and threw tea cups around the dressing room because of your tactical ineptitude.

"My criticism is what I've mentioned before. I think he's been there five years, and spent more money than anybody else other than Chelsea," Souness told Sky Sports.

Come on Graeme your a football man, do some research on the club you apparently love Rafa's average yearly net spend averages out little over 14 million, he has to sell to buy to compete with Arsenal Chelsea & United, make your argument factual or you just look bitter.

"What I can tell you is that if Rafa had been at any other club, any other big club, whether it be Arsenal, Man United or Chelsea, he wouldn't be there because I don't think the supporters at those clubs are like Liverpool supporters.

Whats Arsenal won over the last few years ? Chelsea have not exactly been successfull for teh last couple of years either, did Man Utd not have a slow start last campaign ? is Fergie still there ?

"I think Liverpool fans will be a bit more patient and give a manager a bit more time."

Just like the Utd fans gave Fergie 7 years ?

Souness though, believes that time is fast running out for the Liverpool boss, especially after what he saw as a sub-standard performance in Lyon.

Substandard performance against Lyon ?, sure you wern't watching Everton in the Europa League ?, or is your hate of Rafa blinding your vision ?

The former Reds captain, who won three European Cups at Anfield, was unimpressed with the draw in France that leaves the English club requiring a miracle - in the words of their manager - to reach the knockout stage of the Champions League.

Benitez believes the fates are currently conspiring against him, with 14 players struck down by illness and injury in the past week.

But Souness added: "Injuries are part of the game, especially when you get to November time. That's when they kick in generally.

Injuries are part and parcel of teh game you are correct but any manager in world football would struggle if they had injuries doubts over 12 first team player ya F***ing numpty !!!!

"I think what's behind the first XI isn't good enough to go and win games like that in Lyon.

Your probably correct again thats all part of the building process, nice you didnt mention Rafa has built a starting XI that when fully fit would compete with any Starting XI in world football.

"Lyon aren't a great team. Lyon won at Anfield then lost 4-1 at Nice in the next game they played."

Lyon are playing Champions League football and are a decent team.. Take your bitter anti Rafa views and stick them as far up your arse as you possibly can, your supposed to be a Liverpool man get behind the gaffer and the team ffs, you were a massive success as a player here, failed miserably as a manager don't tarnish your reputation further by taking pot shots at the club thank you.

He is one of the pundits that I dont mind listening to because he can talk from experience with what he achieved as a player with us and generally I think talks a lot of sense.

That said this current tirade of non stop Rafa bashing takes the piss and is uncalled for. The figures he quotes are wrong as one poster on here recently published re spending, he forgets the fact that Rafa has had to build the squad from virtually zero and its not as if we havent won anything since he came. Lst year was our best in the premiership ffs..!

Souness should shut up - he is in the public eye and just gives the usual press w@nkers plenty to write about on their favourite topic.

Rafa has made mistakes we all know that and some of his decisions we dont agree with but Souness should look at the bigger picture before confrming to type with most of our ex players ala Whelan, Redknapp etc.

I've said it before, fantastic player for us, sh*t manager, and just a complete w**ker now.

RedLFCBlood - good post and same points I am referring to.

I wish some of these arsehole bitter ex players would read these boards sometimes, it seems we as fans are more aware than they are.

I didn't even read it. That's what I think of him.

He fu**ed our club up, so he has no right criticising our manager, our team, or even our owners. F**k off.

RedLFCBlood - good post and same points I am referring to.

To be honest mate I'm just saying it as I see it and what I'm seeing at the minute is bitterness of an ex manager who failed at Liverpool so triumphantly, the only rivalry to his success as a failure was the FA cup win against Sunderland in 92. Souness is a man who who had been buying mediocre players for years at Rangers but due to to the poor quality of the league he was having success, he tried the same at Liverpool, how ever his transfer dealings, tactical nous and man management skills got found wanting and I believe he remains bitter about his failure as our manager to this very day.

Getting sick of the people calling for Rafas head now. Especially if their associated with Liverpool FC. Its so disappointing to see.

From what i've seen, most of us appear to back Rafa and want him in charge of the team for as long as possible. I can imagine the players hoping for the same. Its not his fault the club are run by two cowboys who haven't got a clue about business, never mind football.

So for people to come out and say they want Rafa sacked isn't going to help a thing. Will just put him under more pressure, the players under pressure, and things have the potential to go from bad to worse.

I know the KOP will be singing his name throughout against Birmingham but f*ucking hell i just wish these pundits, press, whatever will just f*uck off and leave us alone.

I remain adamant in my belief that Souness (the manager), single-handedly, wrecked everything that had gone before at Liverpool and we haven't (to-date) been able to recover. Maybe i'm wrong but I despise him for that.

I give the man no credence, what so ever.

I remain adamant in my belief that Souness (the manager), single-handedly, wrecked everything that had gone before at Liverpool and we haven't (to-date) been able to recover. Maybe i'm wrong but I despise him for that.

No, you're absolutely right. Not only was his managerial time at Liverpool a disaster but it happened at the worst time. Between arriving in 1991 and leaving in 1994, he filled the squad with second rate players and we lost ground on the other big teams. During that period came the creation of the Premier League AND the re-branding of the European Cup to the Champions League, both in 1992 I believe. So essentially, we were at our lowest point for decades just as the big money started to come into English football. ManUre were getting into the CL and raking it in and we were left playing catch up. It was always going to take a long time to recover from that unless we had our own Abramovich or Abu Dhabi United Group.

Forgot Stan Collymore as well - keeps having a dig.

I remain adamant in my belief that Souness (the manager), single-handedly, wrecked everything that had gone before at Liverpool and we haven't (to-date) been able to recover. Maybe I'm wrong but I despise him for that.

I give the man no credence, what so ever.

Have to agree mate, I was unlucky enough to see him destroy Liverpool FC, as the club was at its pinnacle of success he single handedly went about ripping the heart out of the team and set us into a decline from the powerhouse that we were known as to also rans for many years, we as a club are still counting the costs of his failure to this very day so as a former ex red I respect what he achieved as a player, but when it comes to criticising the manager due to his own failings, he's not qualified to do so.

Envious b***ard souness,back off from rafa you fergie brown nosing c**t.

Have to agree with you Redlfcblood, I to watched what Souness the manager did here, I remember thinking he's crazy to sell Peter Beardsley to Everton, he was my idol, with him and Barnes up front we were untouchable, and he F***ing sold him to Everton. So get off Rafa's back or is it you want us to fail, if we get rid of Rafa that will more than litely be the outcome.

Have to agree with you Redlfcblood, I to watched what Souness the manager did here, I remember thinking he's crazy to sell Peter Beardsley to Everton,

I agree mate selling Beardsley to Everton was sacrilege of the highest order, in Barnes and Beardsley we had two of the most creative players of their generation both were magicians in their own right and were magical to watch, that in itself set the precedent of failure for his tenure as manager IMO.

Liverpool's worst manager since the Second World War.  Inherited, fair enough a team getting old, but still a team filled with talented players.

Didn't last 3 years.  Managed to win the FA Cup but also did a lovely full page spread interview with The S*n.

Won 47 out of 115 League games.  Averaging 1.52 points per game.

Rafa averages 1.93 points per game.

Alex Ferguson averages 1.93 points per game.

I don't have any time for the comments of the only Liverpool manager to have been sacked mid-season in the last 50 years.

I agree mate selling Beardsley to Everton was sacrilege of the highest order, in Barnes and Beardsley we had two of the most creative players of their generation both were magicians in their own right and were magical to watch, that in itself set the precedent of failure for his tenure as manager IMO.

He's a complete whopper Daz - his errors of judgement are well documented and are the only consistent factor of his career, and what is he doing that changes our conception of him? even less than he was doing previously which was F**k all to be honest the man is an embarrassment.

I have a manc mate down the pub and his favourite line is this (the best thing ever to happen for us utd was liverpool giving souness the manager,s job fcking wrecked you ) that just about sums up his time in charge of us .
A great captain great midfielder but sh*t manager and now a shithouse of a pundit.
A question why do all failed managers and ordinary players think they have the right to question successfull ones?. 

"What I can tell you is that if Rafa had been at any other club, any other big club, whether it be Arsenal, Man United or Chelsea, he wouldn't be there because I don't think the supporters at those clubs are like Liverpool supporters.

Whats Arsenal won over the last few years ? Chelsea have not exactly been successfull for teh last couple of years either, did Man Utd not have a slow start last campaign ? is Fergie still there ?

Don't think you can use Chelsea in this bit, they haven't been successful, but they have had a revolving door of managers. Mourinho, Grant, Scolari, Hiddink and now Ancelotti

Have to agree mate, I was unlucky enough to see him destroy Liverpool FC, as the club was at its pinnacle of success he single handedly went about ripping the heart out of the team and set us into a decline from the powerhouse that we were known as to also rans for many years, we as a club are still counting the costs of his failure to this very day so as a former ex red I respect what he achieved as a player, but when it comes to criticising the manager due to his own failings, he's not qualified to do so.

Spot on.  He must rate as one of the worst managers we ever had.  He got rid of players like Beardsley, McMahon and Houghton, replaced them with "talent" like Stewart, Dicks, Piechnik, Walters, etc to name a few.  The number of injuries the squad suffered under him was untrue and according to Rushie in his autobiography, were all down to Souness and his training methods.  He devastated the club so for him to come out now and spout this crap is unbelievable.

He was a brilliant player and a fantastic captain, but a sh*te manager, who too often has a dig at us.  I wish he and the other ex Reds would just shut up and stop feeding the media with crap like this.  And if they really don't give a toss any more about Liverpool and want to mouth off, then at least get their facts right.  Morons.