I see what you're saying Jon and if Jürgen Klopp can't coax them away; who can?
(Apart from Unai Emery with Draxler, of course).
I don't think it's anything to do with who is trying to coax whom personally mouse, I'm sure Klopp get most players around a table/on the phone he can sell his vision but I'd guess there are dozens of other managers who can do the same
On Draxler? Don't think we were ever in for him
we were linked in the press literally a couple of days before he went to PSG (probably leaked by his agent to push trough the PSG move) I heard a couple of trusted Liverpool journos saying Jürgen wasn't interested in him
Moot point Draxler really
Not a dig at you btw buddy but Draxler's move to PSG disproves some of the myths surrounding the January window. I digress...
No not really buddy, like anything if there is a willingness to sell then it can happen at any time like with anything in life really, by the sounds of things Draxler was available simple as that rather than a player a club didn't want to leave and then the hard work starts in convincing the selling club... if they want to sell or are willing you're half way there
Like with most of our January signings in the past few years
Suarez. Willingness to sell by Ajax, due to the ban for biting etc.. Luis said himself he wanted to stay and captain them to the league and them move on the summer but he was told that he should look to move January. He even went back and was given a league winners medal because of the minimum apparences was reaches even though he said it felt slightly hollow
Sturridge. Not wanted at Chelsea
Coutinho. Hadn't settles at Inter
You could argue that the only one we pushed we overpaid for and didn't work.. Carroll
I guess, by that, you're suggesting (but you can correct me if I'm wrong) that Draxler, Pulisic & Brandt were 1st, 2nd & 3rd 'choice' then, if not in that order but...
Surely then, if we don't sign either Pulisic or Brandt in the Summer [assuming that you are right and they aren't available now] then, by default; whoever we end up signing will indeed be 4th or 5th choice?
As I said I don't think we were ever interested in Draxler
However I believe that Pulisic and Brandt are both Jürgen's first choices, and that there is a high possibility he would take both not either/or
If we don't sign them in the summer then you could make that argument yes, but football like life isn't linear and is a moveable beast.. However I think he will want to give himself every chance with them and then reassess if they fail
Here we are on the
assuming they aren't available now....
I guess they would be
available bur we are back to that
willingness to sell Rather than available. .. Draxler I believe was available, Brandt/Pulisic there isn't a willingness to sell
From a
sellers point of view the reason January isn't a great window is that if the willingness isn't there its a short window to replace them, it could derail your season, you may not be able to replace them with a suitable target, so for market value is it worth digging your heels in unless you get a ridiculous offer?
Would Leverkusen sell one of their most effective players mid season when they may not be able to replace suitably and risk f**king their season up? Or would they rather keep him until the summer when Tey are fully aware of where they are and how they can replace with time to do it?
Say we sign Brandt... Leverkusen then panic with a replacement... a replacement that may not be available or who they have to over pay for, then the club they buy from need to do the same. . All in a shortened winter window...
It's difficult unless there's
willingness to sell as you don't want them or they aren't integral to how you're doing. Buying teams better players as we should target as they could improve us isn't easy and especially so in this window
I don't mean to be busting your chops here Jon but I'm honestly confused by what you're saying (my napper hasn't been quite the same since the stroke) and I find it genuinely interesting but - am I wrong here?
* If it really is the agents and middlemen who set the guideline on price (presumably down in a big part to personal greed) then really it's them who won't want to be dealing with Liverpool [Jürgen] and not the selling clubs? I mean: why would any agent ever want to deal with Liverpool if other clubs want his player? Should the club [or Jürgen if you prefer] continue to take a unilateral stance and never play their game of course.
Not what I'm saying mate
What I'm saying is that I would highly doubt that a club (Jürgen) would go to a selling club and ask for availability or price of a target
The club is more likely to speak to a players agent ( as that agent likely has other clients at the club ) to ask them...
More often than not nowadays a price is written in a contract, or within constant agent/club conversations agents know their clients current worth to his current club, so a potential buying club would approach an agent to find out
For example
We want Brandt
Klopp likely knows his agent, he asks about if there is a buy out clause (like with Karius) or if not what the club would entertain. If the agent (for want of a price) says yeah you should get him for 20-25m
So Jürgen sanctions a January bid of 18m (with wriggle room to sort a deal) but Leverkusen because of the shortened window, lack of time to replace, potential to derail their season and the key, unwillingness to sell cone back and state 45m
Do we pay that?
If we do what are the ramifications?
That agent knows we will pay whatever and can use that to his advantage in the future, potential budget and FFP issues
But we know that in the summer he will be available for 20-25?
All comes down to willingness to sell not if they are available
* Surely then, if that unilateral stance remains the case; logic dictates that we [Jürgen or whoever] are never going to end up buying the Draxlers, Brandts and Pulisics of this world and will always have to settle for 'next best'? And...
* Surely, come May (when more clubs are obviously going to be in the hunt) the same agents will have even more clubs to pick from and overtures from Liverpool [Jürgen] become even easier to ignore. Remember the names of all those previous 'January links' who we were promised would "be cheaper in the Summer"? Where are they now? Exactly.
I don't think it's a unilateral stance.. It's market forces
If you remember last January we signed a pre contract with Joel Matip
That was sorted with his agent (again Jürgen's knowledge and relationship with Matips agent ) and that was pre arranged for the summer window
Deals can be put into place now for summer completion
But again it's not linear, things change
I love our chats mouse. I really hope that life it getting back on track following your health scares buddy