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      General LFC Transfer rumours/gossip thread

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      -LFC-
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28520: Mar 16, 2017 12:02:31 am
      We all know what calibre of player we need to seriously compete again and who we've missed out on in the past. This has to be rectified or an Arsenal situation beckons.

      Good players or "improvements" are one thing, but great players -- world class players (at least a couple) -- are ultimately what's required. You don't regularly compete at the very top without them; that's the bottom line.
      JD
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28521: Mar 16, 2017 01:24:35 am
      A lot of the talk last Summer focusing on Zielinski was nothing more than smoke while Wijnaldum got finished and was played up ad nausea by his agent looking for a move.

      We did not miss out on a £15 million player while trying to go cheap and spend and spend £25 million on his substitute.

      Good point well made.

      Wonder if he still has his LFC shirt?
      KS67
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28522: Mar 16, 2017 08:00:12 am
      A lot of the talk last Summer focusing on Zielinski was nothing more than smoke while Wijnaldum got finished and was played up ad nausea by his agent looking for a move.

      We did not miss out on a £15 million player while trying to go cheap and spend and spend £25 million on his substitute.

      You can believe it or not...but to think that the club does not use agents/players as smokescreens to their advantage while chasing real targets is naive.

      Now if you want to say Grujic was second choice to Zielinski then I would buy that as being more than possible seeing as the age and make up of the players are similar.


      The idea that we paid more for Wijnaldum than we would have Zielinski therefore that means Zielinski wasn't a higher priority is odd.

      Especially as my previous post pointed out Gotze was the player we tried to sign before Mane and Mane cost more in the end.

      If you want to bring smokescreens into things to make it all seem like we didn't miss out on Dahoud and Zielinski before signing Wijnaldum fair enough.

      But if you are going be making points about people being 'naive' then perhaps be more self aware when stating final price is the only factor we can judge whether a club went for it's first or second target.

      Personally I don't think you could accuse me of being 'naive' in any sense regarding our routinely embarrassing, ineffectual and wasteful transfer activity.

      What baffles me is the way in which our own fans rewrite history in order to paint failure as success and hide beneath the comfort blanket of "perhaps if we sign all of our third choice targets and show no ambition to sign either the best available or best available young players then we can have a failed title challenge once a half decade"...

      The fans of this club deserve better than we are given and it's because we accept this mediocrity that has descended since 2010.

      Perhaps if the club attempted to live by the simple principle of "If you are first you are first. If you are second, you are nowhere" when it comes to transfers then we may find outselves finishing higher than 6th every f**king year.

      No more leaking targets to the press then leaking your excuses when it all falls through.

      No more telling everyone you are after a 'profile' of young players who can improve massively but being nowhere to be seen when the best young talent moves.

      Just go sign only good footballers for 18months and see where it gets you. And before anyone tells me we can't, we f**king can. Our club is richer than Juventus, a club with infinitely more ambition, but acts like f**king Torino.
      « Last Edit: Mar 16, 2017 08:51:28 am by KS67 »
      bad boy bubby
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      • @KaiserQueef
      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28523: Mar 16, 2017 08:43:01 am
      But given he fairly clearly wanted Brandt and...
      Gotze and... Pulisic and... Dahoud and..  Draxler and...

      Yeah buddy you're 100% right. So is young 'arry boy too to be fair- in that, it will be funny; in fact it already is. What with the minute men coming out early and all. 😉 😊
      bad boy bubby
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      • @KaiserQueef
      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28524: Mar 16, 2017 09:07:32 am
      The idea that we paid more for Wijnaldum than we would have Zielinski therefore that means Zielinski wasn't a higher priority is odd.
      Indeed KS and especially when you consider a number of these Jürgen "experts" told us that Jürgen doesn't like to spend "big".

      That aside; it really is a daft 'point'(?)... a player we want [striker X] is available on a free. We try to sign him. He opts to go to Chelsea [for eg]. We look elsewhere and sign striker Y for £25m. We have spent £25m more to sign our second choice.

      They'll clutch at any straw mate; their list of excuses is endless.

      #Misplacedloyalties 😉

      « Last Edit: Mar 16, 2017 09:29:47 am by bad boy bubby »
      KS67
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28525: Mar 16, 2017 09:15:34 am
      Gotze and... Pulisic and... Dahoud and..  Draxler and...

      Yeah buddy you're 100% right. So is young 'arry boy too to be fair- in that, it will be funny; in fact it already is. What with the minute men coming out early and all. 😉 😊


      And Dembele, he went to Dortmund.

      A club who have the same principles as we claim to be have but with less money and more ambition.

      What's the excuse there?

      Usually it was he's already agreed to move so we stood no chance... which then opens up two depressing possibilities.

      Liverpool aren't very proactive and/or competent in the transfer market... unbelievable!

      Or players who we'd love to sign genuinely see Dortmund as a better option.

      harrydunn08
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28526: Mar 16, 2017 11:06:23 am
      Does anyone on here (Mick, BBB, KS67, etc) really look at the likes of Mane and Gini as lower quality options than the other players we missed out on?  We may have missed out on Gotze and Dahoud, but I don't think we sacrificed any quality in going with our backup options.  I'll gladly admit that we need better quality depth in the side, but not if it means having to offer silly wages to players like Draxler to get him to choose us over PSG.  There are other fish in the sea.  Jürgen's project is going to take time.  As long as we are making consistent progress and continuous improvement (which we seem to be since Jürgen arrived) then I will be happy and afford him the patience and time he needs to be successful.  I also understand that other supporters patience has (perhaps justifiably) run out, and that's OK -- you are entitled to your opinions just like I'm entitled to mine.  We just probably won't ever see eye-to-eye on this issue....

      Cheers lads :)
      heimdall
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28527: Mar 16, 2017 11:52:48 am
      But I would have serious concerns if we are constantly having to settle for our 3rd or 4th choices. That's a fundamental problem that needs addressed.


      But hang on here, you are making a rather big assumption that the 3rd and 4th choices are significantly worse than the 1st or 2nd choices. They may all be of a fairly similar standard and just be a list of players identified for a position with some being more available than others. I'm fairly sure that Klopp has on several occasions said that he won't sign anyone just to sign someone, hence why we haven't signed anyone in the January windows.
      FL Red
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28528: Mar 16, 2017 12:23:26 pm
      But hang on here, you are making a rather big assumption that the 3rd and 4th choices are significantly worse than the 1st or 2nd choices. They may all be of a fairly similar standard and just be a list of players identified for a position with some being more available than others. I'm fairly sure that Klopp has on several occasions said that he won't sign anyone just to sign someone, hence why we haven't signed anyone in the January windows.

      So you are of the mind that it's ok for us to never be able to land our 1st (or even 2nd) choice? That's the point I was making. I wasn't making any assumption about  their perceived quality. Let's stay on target here if we are going to debate this. If Klopp has a list of priorities, you are ok with him NEVER getting his 1st or 2nd choices and always "settling" for 3rd or 4th (or nothing at all)?
      bigmick
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28529: Mar 16, 2017 02:32:22 pm
      It's hard keeping up on here sometimes.

      In January we couldn't think of a single player on planet Earth who could improve our squad. Fast forward three months and suddenly Jürgen's got a list of five players for each position who are better than the ones we've got.

      F****** hell if that's not progress I don't know what is.
      bad boy bubby
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28530: Mar 16, 2017 05:41:37 pm
      It's hard keeping up on here sometimes.

      In January we couldn't think of a single player on planet Earth who could improve our squad. Fast forward three months and suddenly Jürgen's got a list of five players for each position who are better than the ones we've got.

      F****** hell if that's not progress I don't know what is.

      Ha ha ha... as KS said "mental gymnastics". Serious question mick: do you think they know they're doing it? 😄😄
      Magillionare
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28531: Mar 16, 2017 05:45:48 pm
      End of the day. You (used collectively including myself in here) don't know sh*t about how things work or who targets are. We're all spraffing sh*te. 'Klopp wanted this play' 'This player was our number one target' 'we had this done for x amount but ended up paying for y instead.' It's all propaganda.


      Good fun to talk about mind you
      bad boy bubby
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      • @KaiserQueef
      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28532: Mar 16, 2017 06:04:18 pm
      Does anyone on here (Mick, BBB, KS67, etc) really look at the likes of Mane and Gini as lower quality options than the other players we missed out on?

      Jesus F***ing wept; what a question. 😄

      Let's just say that it doesn't matter if we (me, you, the dogs in the street) believe them to be of a "lower quality": the truth is... wait for it...

      Jürgen DID. 😉

      Because (and here's the simple truth); if he didn't believe, what you said to be true, then... wait for it...

      HE WOULDN'T HAVE TRIED TO SIGN OTHERS FIRST. 😉

      Truth is - for as much as we can coo over the input of Gini and Sadio; no one [NO ONE] can say if Jürgen's 1st choices would have made any worse an impact. 😉

      Daft questions aside: it was nice to see this season's two most expensive signings hit the ground running. 😎
      Swab
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28533: Mar 16, 2017 06:10:05 pm
      The annual dance has begun early this year I see, as the usual suspects position themselves for a couple of months of wumming where suddenly every single report or piece of gossip is suddenly ultra reliable, and all so they can say "I told you so", or go off on one about "net spend", which is funny because many of the same people argued about Rafa's total spend, instead of net.

      If nothing else, it's fun to watch them trying to get a rise with their little fishing trips, and even funnier when they get increasingly desperate when no bugger takes any notice.

      I'm looking forwards to lots of stories and gossip from those unimpeachable sources like The Metro, or The Mail, or that good old standby for wums everywhere, Total Football.clickbait, which suddenly become gospel truth, but perhaps most importantly, I'm looking forwards to those who conveniently forget Klopp's own words (except they trust him dontchaknow), or ignore them completely, as we are starting to see already.
      I trust that Klopp wants the best players he can get, if others don't trust him or his word, why don't they just come out and say so  :confused-smiley-013:


      It's all rather funny and a little sad.
      KS67
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28534: Mar 16, 2017 06:20:42 pm
      Does anyone on here (Mick, BBB, KS67, etc) really look at the likes of Mane and Gini as lower quality options than the other players we missed out on?

      Yes, over the last six or seven years this has absolutely been the case.

      I think we may have dodged a bullet when it comes to Gotze specifically because he can't stop eating pies.

      But the overall point stands, when we won't spend the same in wages or in fees as the clubs above us then it requires us to be nearly perfect in the transfer window to continual close the gap.

      Our league finishes have not been of a side that is closing the gap, that applies to all but one season since FSG took over. If the club is habitually settling for non-priority targets, especially if they then move to clubs with less financial power than ourselves, it begs the question how the f**k can we reasonably close the gap?

      What bothers me more than the club settling for second best is that some fans, in a bid to look like bastions of unbreakable faith, will attempt to make excuses, distort reality or simply never mention this obvious pattern.

      If you like Wijnaldum then fair fucks. If you think he is the best possible central midfielder we could have signed last summer then fair fucks.

      But don't pretend he was the first choice of Klopp or the club.

      Secondly, we have all seen discussions of potential signings where people rightly recognise that the player doesn't fit what is the 'right profile' for our transfer strategy.

      At this stage it cannot be a shock to anyone to here that Liverpool FC is largely looking to sign young players with the potential not the finished product. But the reality is, despite being one of the richest clubs in the world, we don't even do this strategy well.

      For example, Mbappe is probably going to leave Monaco soon. Is young, bags of potential and could be a genuine star for years to come.

      By our own owners strategy this would make him an absolute gold standard player to pursue, but we all have to be honest and admit that when he (or other players of that ilk move) Liverpool FC won't be within a country mile of the negotiations. The only player that meets that criteria we have actually managed to sign is Firmino, he is the lone example.

      Sign the best players.
      Or sign the best young players..

      Both make sense to me, but this club does neither. Is it any wonder we continually languish in midtable?

      I've developed an easy system for this summers transfer window, it's based entirely on what has happened under FSG in previous windows it goes like this.

      1. Liverpool want a player.
      2. Does anyone else vaguely as good or better than Liverpool also want that player?
      3. Liverpool will end up not managing to sign that player.
      4. Liverpool will brief journalists they tried but it's hard to compete
      5. Repeat forever.

      It will simple but will serve you well this summer.
      « Last Edit: Mar 16, 2017 07:29:18 pm by KS67 »
      FL Red
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28535: Mar 16, 2017 08:18:00 pm
      KopiteLuke
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28536: Mar 16, 2017 08:23:26 pm

      Anfield HQ Retweeted
      Glenn Price‏Verified account @GlennPrice94  28m28 minutes ago
      Sources at Liverpool and Fulham both say reports stating #LFC have won the race to sign Fulham's Ryan Sessegnon are untrue.

      FL Red
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28537: Mar 16, 2017 08:51:04 pm
      Anfield HQ Retweeted
      Glenn Price‏Verified account @GlennPrice94  28m28 minutes ago
      Sources at Liverpool and Fulham both say reports stating #LFC have won the race to sign Fulham's Ryan Sessegnon are untrue.



      LFC sources quick to poor cold water on that one. They only want positive spin announced on their own timing. :D
      what-a-hit-son
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28538: Mar 16, 2017 08:57:05 pm
      The idea that we paid more for Wijnaldum than we would have Zielinski therefore that means Zielinski wasn't a higher priority is odd.

      Especially as my previous post pointed out Gotze was the player we tried to sign before Mane and Mane cost more in the end.

      If you want to bring smokescreens into things to make it all seem like we didn't miss out on Dahoud and Zielinski before signing Wijnaldum fair enough.

      But if you are going be making points about people being 'naive' then perhaps be more self aware when stating final price is the only factor we can judge whether a club went for it's first or second target.

      Personally I don't think you could accuse me of being 'naive' in any sense regarding our routinely embarrassing, ineffectual and wasteful transfer activity.

      What baffles me is the way in which our own fans rewrite history in order to paint failure as success and hide beneath the comfort blanket of "perhaps if we sign all of our third choice targets and show no ambition to sign either the best available or best available young players then we can have a failed title challenge once a half decade"...

      The fans of this club deserve better than we are given and it's because we accept this mediocrity that has descended since 2010.

      Perhaps if the club attempted to live by the simple principle of "If you are first you are first. If you are second, you are nowhere" when it comes to transfers then we may find outselves finishing higher than 6th every f**king year.

      No more leaking targets to the press then leaking your excuses when it all falls through.

      No more telling everyone you are after a 'profile' of young players who can improve massively but being nowhere to be seen when the best young talent moves.

      Just go sign only good footballers for 18months and see where it gets you. And before anyone tells me we can't, we f**king can. Our club is richer than Juventus, a club with infinitely more ambition, but acts like f**king Torino.

      What makes me laugh is when people talk about when Moores didn't move with the times, etc, etc. He didn't, so those people are right, but, the same is happening right now only this time, the thing that is leaving us behind is the big money wages that the big players above us in European football are paying. Whether people like that or not it is what's happening and been happening.

      Different times that we need to move with.
      Aggerdoo
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28539: Mar 17, 2017 10:10:56 am
      bigmick
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28540: Mar 17, 2017 12:40:30 pm
      I must confess I don't really buy into this idea that it doesn't really matter if players are first choice, fifth choice or fourth choice so long as they are better than what we've currently got. Surely the point isn't just to improve our squad, it's to close the gap between us and the team who is winning the league?

      Look at the left back position for example. There, we've got a first choice of a right footed midfielder, backed up by a brainless tattooists model. Now I should think we could "improve" on THAT situation very easily, buy any fullback in the league just about. Buy Watfords left back, Bournemouths, Sunderlands maybe, (I've no idea who any of them are) and like as not they'll be a better bet than Moreno at least, then we can say we've "improved" and it'll be true. That won't however make much odds in our quest to win the league I shouldn't think, it'll merely mean that we have a slightly better squad than we had previously.

      Why not go all out and buy a really top left back? Why not buy one who the other top teams think "f***s sake I wish we'd have bought that bloke"? Because ultimately that's what happens, the teams with the best players usually win the league. Now there is a chance you can let everyone else pick up their "first choice" players and assemble a team out of the jumble of left over cast offs and journeymen and still win something (Leicester proved its possibility), but surely everyone would accept you have a better chance if you get in there and get a couple of your "first picks" too, wouldn't they?

      It'd be different if Jürgen was trying to get Messi, Ronaldo, Gareth Bale and the like, but Zielinski? Brandt? Dahoud? These are/were players that Liverpool really ought to be able to make an offer to that is irrefusable.

         
      mcarz
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28541: Mar 17, 2017 12:51:02 pm
      I must confess I don't really buy into this idea that it doesn't really matter if players are first choice, fifth choice or fourth choice so long as they are better than what we've currently got. Surely the point isn't just to improve our squad, it's to close the gap between us and the team who is winning the league?

      Look at the left back position for example. There, we've got a first choice of a right footed midfielder, backed up by a brainless tattooists model. Now I should think we could "improve" on THAT situation very easily, buy any fullback in the league just about. Buy Watfords left back, Bournemouths, Sunderlands maybe, (I've no idea who any of them are) and like as not they'll be a better bet than Moreno at least, then we can say we've "improved" and it'll be true. That won't however make much odds in our quest to win the league I shouldn't think, it'll merely mean that we have a slightly better squad than we had previously.

      Why not go all out and buy a really top left back? Why not buy one who the other top teams think "f***s sake I wish we'd have bought that bloke"? Because ultimately that's what happens, the teams with the best players usually win the league. Now there is a chance you can let everyone else pick up their "first choice" players and assemble a team out of the jumble of left over cast offs and journeymen and still win something (Leicester proved its possibility), but surely everyone would accept you have a better chance if you get in there and get a couple of your "first picks" too, wouldn't they?

      It'd be different if Jürgen was trying to get Messi, Ronaldo, Gareth Bale and the like, but Zielinski? Brandt? Dahoud? These are/were players that Liverpool really ought to be able to make an offer to that is irrefusable.

         

      The exception in all that is Brandt. Bayern look to be the front runners for his signature. Going to Bayern will probably make more sense to him than coming here.

      1. Gets to stay in Germany
      2. Wins league titles far more often than they don't
      3. Compete for Champions League titles consistently
      4. Surrounded by world class players etc.
      5. Will no doubt be offered really good wages too
      SM
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      Re: General Transfer rumours/gossip thread
      Reply #28542: Mar 17, 2017 03:40:20 pm
      The exception in all that is Brandt. Bayern look to be the front runners for his signature. Going to Bayern will probably make more sense to him than coming here.

      1. Gets to stay in Germany
      2. Wins league titles far more often than they don't
      3. Compete for Champions League titles consistently
      4. Surrounded by world class players etc.
      5. Will no doubt be offered really good wages too

      We are the exact opposite of everything you have said above in that list (obviously no 1 is irrelevant).

      How depressing what we have become.

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