Trending Topics

      Next match: v [] Thu 1st Jan @ 1:00 am

      Today is the 1st of June and on this date LFC's match record is P6 W4 D2 L0

      May I dare a little optimism??

      Read 7102 times
      0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.
      l2k83
      • Forum Erik Meijer
      • *

      • 31 posts |
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #23: Jun 04, 2010 05:57:46 pm
      I'd like to see Agger continue at left back, felt he slotted in well and a lot better defensively than Insua (and I do like this kid) and hes not too bad going forward either.
      YNWABairn
      • Forum Emlyn Hughes
      • ****

      • 835 posts |
      • Anti Modern Football
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #24: Jun 04, 2010 06:17:10 pm
      Sorry to say, but I don't think Stevie, Masch or Nando will be here for us to think about how to play them in matches
      Christ
      • Forum Legend - Benitez
      • *****

      • 1,209 posts | 40 
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #25: Jun 04, 2010 07:28:02 pm
      Rob, I'll be blunt.

      Piss off to another thread, eh?

      I'm at work with a bit of spare time on my hands. I've contributed to the doom and gloom threads as well as the ones proposing positive action. At this point in time, there is little else I can do.

      So, instead of wallowing in self pity and babbling about the potential death of a club that I have loved for as long as I can remember, I've created a 'what if' thread from the notion that there could be buyers lined up, regardless of how infinitely small that possibility may be.

      Are you telling me that posting that rant is time better spent? If you didn't like the sentiment of this thread then why have you bothered posting in it? Everyone else seems to have bothered to read through it and appreciate the sentiment, is it that f***in hard to understand?

      Sooner or later, one way or another, we will have a new manager. The idea of this thread ('game' if that makes it easier for you) is to simply suggest what you would LIKE to see changed, not what you (pessimistically) THINK will happen.

      There are so many threads and plenty or forums for you to go and vent your frustrations in so kindly DO ONE!

      I hear you Repo man..  xxxxx:action-smiley-065: we do need to discuss the future, whether its grey or not!

      just ignore idiots.. who dont even want to enter healthy debate
      Red5man
      • Forum Legend - Dalglish
      • *****

      • 9,616 posts | 76 
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #26: Jun 04, 2010 07:32:03 pm
      Sorry to say, but I don't think Stevie, Masch or Nando will be here for us to think about how to play them in matches

      That's the F***ing spirit we need these days. F**k off.

                          Reina

                    Skrtel         Dagger
      Johnson                                  Insua

                        Mascherano
              Gerrard                Aquilani

            Maxi                            Babel
                          Torres


      Does look good to me, that.
      Reprobate
      • Forum Legend - Paisley
      • *****
      • Started Topic

      • 11,055 posts | 436 
      • Avatar by Kitster29@Deviantart.com
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #27: Jun 04, 2010 08:17:40 pm
      I hear you Repo man..  xxxxx:action-smiley-065: we do need to discuss the future, whether its grey or not!

      just ignore idiots.. who dont even want to enter healthy debate
      To be fair, we sorted it out via messages so there's no hard feelings about his post now.
      Let's just keep to the topic.
      MIRO
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 12,989 posts | 3124 
      • Trust The Universe
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #28: Jun 05, 2010 09:23:19 am
      Hello Mate.

      A good topic overlooked by other crap.

      Me.

      Simples. 4-4-2.

      Pass and Move.

      Bring back the Boot Room.
      bigvYNWA
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 16,795 posts | 994 
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #29: Jun 05, 2010 09:31:58 am

      Would love to see that mentality back. Unfortunately, nothing like that will be allowed to flourish under the meddling cu*ts we have in charge right now, i feel.
      RedLFCBlood
      • Guest
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #30: Jun 05, 2010 10:21:32 am
      Hello Mate.

      A good topic overlooked by other crap.

      Me.

      Simples. 4-4-2.

      Pass and Move.

      Bring back the Boot Room.

      Exactly how I feel, all of it.
      jake15919
      • Forum Graeme Souness
      • ***

      • 359 posts | 14 
      • Something, something, something, the dark side.
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #31: Jun 05, 2010 11:12:37 am
      OK.
      Off the field.
      The new owners turn up and we have a Stalinesque purge. All the current board mysteriously disappear and someone gets paid a few quid to Photoshop them out of all of the clubs official history. A new board is appointed. Everyone on the board is a Liverpool fan with a proven track record in their field, no more Chelsea supporting strike breakers. Kenny is MB tasked with ensuring that all board decisions are made with the long term health of the club in mind not short term profit,  and that all communication with the fans and media are done in the traditional Liverpool manner.
      A new manager is appointed, take your pick from LVG, GH, FR et al. I've heard that that Rafa bloke is still available, Jeez the dick that sacked him must feel like a bit of an idiot now.
      On the field
      The new manager gets each player in for a personal interview. Highlights include
      ' I'm sorry Jamie but your opportunities in the team will be limited this season, but I would be delighted if you would accept the position of Player / Assistant manager'.
      'Pepe, you are just the type of guy I'm looking for to be my captain. Here, try this armband on for size'
      'Stevie you are the best center mid in the world, but you either stop standing there with your hands on your hips sulking or I will personally drive you to the airport for your flight to Madrid.'
      'Arda, you're on the left. Some real legends have played in your position over the years. Make them proud'.
      'Wilson. You are a young lad but go out there and prove yourself. Don,t be afraid of making mistakes, Agger will look after you.'
      Mata. You are playing up front with Torres.'
      'Lahm, anything you can do to help teach Johnson how to defend will be greatly appreciated.'
      So we play

                       Mata   Torres

      Turan         Masc     Gerrard     Maxi

      Lahm        Agger      Wilson    Johnson

                          Pepe (c)  

      We go on to totally own the league. Ferguson has a heart attack and retires in dispair with Liverpool firmly back on our perch.

      Well that was fun and it took my mind of the awful reality of our situation. Thanks for the thread Reprobate.



      chats
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 31,497 posts | 2869 
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #32: Jun 05, 2010 12:04:41 pm
      Simples. 4-4-2.

      Pass and Move.

      Bring back the Boot Room.

      Agreed completely.

      Can't see it happening though.
      vitez
      • Forum Legend - Fagan
      • *****

      • 2,701 posts | 156 
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #33: Jun 05, 2010 12:30:01 pm
      I've said it once and I'll say it again.  A traditional 4-4-2 is best played rigidly, we don't have the right players to employ such a philosophy.  Played more fluidly it creates massive holes in our defensive game allowing teams a lot of space on the ball and together with our defenders being relatively slow, we're very vulnerable on the counter especially against fast teams. 

      Furthermore it closes down some good passing angles if it's too flat.  The 4-4-2 is the most balanced formation that makes good use of the wide areas of the pitch (of which we have no wide players to play in) and works quite well when you have 2 fast wingers (which we don't) who are also good crossers of the ball (none in midfield) it is however conservative and doesn't make allowance for exceptional players in either defensive (Agger/Mascherano) or offensive roles (Torres/Aquilani) for either your team or your opponent and is often useless against a 4-1-X-X based formations (which are becoming more and more common) where the other team basically refuses to play (Remember the Fulham 0-0 draw, Bolton at home every week, Sunderland when playing with Cana/Cattermole higher up, Man City under Hughes etc.) and put most of their players behind the ball.
      gazza31
      • Banned
      • *****

      • 2,751 posts | 35 
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #34: Jun 05, 2010 02:28:39 pm
      First post on this forum, but had to comment on this thread. Rumours abound at present that a takeover is on and this is why the parting of the waves with Rafa happened so soon. The new owners didn't want him and didn't want to take over the club and immediately become the bad guys sacking Rafa hence the speed of his departure.

      So theres the good news

      As for the bad, well its who the new manager will be, Daglish is pushing for O'Neil a young manager who has cut his teeth and is looking for a step up, lets face it if he doesn't get this job that will be his last chance at managing a true European Giant (even if a poorly one at present) He's not going to get the knock from Milan, Real Barca or the Scum now his he.

      The New owners want Sven (told you it was bad news)

      Anyway all might be tripe but comes from people CLAIMING to be ITK so don't shoot the messenger

      YNWA
      hardcoresoldier
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 5,160 posts | 1288 
      • The Liverpool Way is The Only Way
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #35: Jun 05, 2010 04:38:32 pm
      Reprobate, may you dare a little optimism? Too f**king right you can mate. With all the doom and gloom around the place it's refreshing to see people trying to look forward. What's done is done and we have to get on with it. There is absolutely no point in dwelling on the past now, we now have to adapt to a new environment, a new manager, new ideas and more than probably a new footballing philosophy. I'm not happy at all about what's happened, I'm f**king fuming to be honest but life goes on and a change is occuring. Whether that change is for the better then only time will tell, whoever the new manager is, he will have my support, I won't agree with it, but he will have my support.

      I placed a similar post to this at the start of last season, when Alonso and Arbeloa had left. The post was to do with being forced to play the youngsters more often if there was insufficient investment, there was insufficient investment ( no shock there ), the youngsters didn't play more often though. I'm hoping that the new manager will be able to inject much needed enthusiasm into the squad, nobody can argue that we have looked stale during the course of last season. As previous posters have stated, there was no Plan B or Plan C. I believe we only need a Plan B, no need for Plan C, that will just confuse the issue. One positive to take from this debacle is that everyone will start with a clean slate. Some players who were possibly on their way now may stay, players may be given freedom to express themselves.

      If, and again this is a big if, the owners can guarantee that any transfer money generated from player sales will be re-invested, I'd like to see quite a few deadweights shifted on. Certain players do not fit in with the Liverpool Way. Kuyt, Lucas, Riera, Degen, El Zhar, NGog and Babel could altogether generate around between 35-40 million. Add this to the reported 5 million and we could bring in 2 top quality players or 1 world class player.

      I'm going to try and show how we'd absorb the loss of these players by blending in youth.

      The Goalkeeper -
      We have Pepe Reina between the sticks, a better stopper in the world?, I don't b***ard think so. Diego Cavalieri, an able understudy, not the best by a long stretch, but a capable understudy nevertheless. So nothing to worry about in this department.

      The Defence -
      At right back we are spoilt for choice really, Glen Johnson, the natural choice for many supporters, on his day unstoppable, on other days he's unfathomable. Stephen Darby is another player who is more than capable of holding his own, had a good spell at Swindon too. We also have the versatile Kelly as well. So you see, there is really no need for Degen at all, he has to go.

      At left back we have Insua, started the season well but fell by the wayside towards the end, needs to shed a stone or so. I'd keep him first choice next season if he can reproduce his early form. Agger did a great job there when called upon so he is an option too. We also have Chris Mavinga who has impressed at both left back and centre back too this season.

      Then we have the centre of defence, Carragher has still got it, I don't care what anyone says. When playing with a settled defensive unit there's nobody better at the Club, got a good 2 seasons left in him at least. Agger is going to become a legend if he can stay injury free, while Carragher is the storm and the fury, Agger is the ambience and the calm. I see so much of Alan Hansen in him, that calming presence, the way he glides with the ball. Then you have Psycho Skrtel, prone to lapses in concentration but never free from injury long enough to try and establish himself as a fixture in the first team. Ayala has done what has been asked of him and again, is another youngster who is more than capable of holding his own. Commanding in the air, something we were lacking last season. I'm not bothered about Kyrgiakos to be honest, he shored our defence up when he arrived but I'm sure Ayala could have equalled or bettered the Greek's contribution if he had been given the chance.

      The Midfield -  

      The biggest problem area that needs resolving. Lucas must go if we are to shed our negative output from what I believe to be the most important area of the side. He is never going to be what we need, as hard as he tries it produces nothing. Mascherano, the midfield general, the hunter, the destroyer, you will struggle to find a player with more heart and fire in the outfield last season. I also feel he upped his passing game and was more willing to strike the ball towards the back end of the season. Aquilani, showed brief glimpses of his class last season, that cannot be questioned. Often on the bench and never utilised for fear of him injuring himself, hopefully we get a manager who thinks to play him more often than not. When he plays we have a cutting edge, we move the ball quickly, unlike the much failed Plan A of last season. We also have Jay Spearing, not many people rate the lad on here, but I think that given a run in the side he can prove a lot of doubters wrong. Yes I know he's small, but so is Masch and that means f**k all to me.

      When Aquilani is injured who do we play?, why Yossi Benayoun of course, it's no secret that he plays best through the middle. One of the few creative players at the Club, so let's maximise that undoubted creative potential. He has stated he'd like to stay at the Club and with a new manager he may just get his wish and play more often than not. I don't blame him for thinking about leaving us after the way he was treated recently, when we were screaming out for a creative spark in the middle he had to watch Lucas Sidewalker stifle our attack. I'd also like to see us sign Javi Martinez or Rafael van der Vaart, both top quality players that can give us that extra something from the midfield.

      The Wingers -

      Oh my, how we need some decent wingers. In an ideal world we'd get David Silva but that is never going to happen, is it?. Babel, Kuyt and Riera will hopefully be sold. On the other hand, would Babel and Riera respond positively to a new manager?. There's no doubt that on their day Riera and Babel can be highly effective. Both players suffer from emotional issues and insecurities, maybe a frsh face and some open encouragement may change their mindset, that would be like 2 new signings in itself. We have Pacheco, such promise, yet he was constantly ignored last season and I really felt for the lad. He's a really tricky kid is Dani and can play in a variety of positions. David Amoo is another player I'd like to see more of, fast as f**k he is. from what I've seen so far I've been impressed.

      Then we have the possibility of signing Arda Turan, the rumour was that Rafa had lined up a player plus cash deal for him this summer, which would have meant Babel going in the other direction. I haven't seen much of him but he can get past his man quite consistently and can play anywhere acroos the midfield, versatility is the key component here. And last but not least, Maxi Rodriguez. I liked what I saw of him last season, he gave us stability in an area of the field that was faltering badly. Towards the end of the season his confidence grew and I have high hopes for him this season, he's had time to bed in now. I'm confident we'll see the real Rodriguez next season.

      Strikers -

      This is where I feel we should have no issues at all. In Torres we have the best striker on the planet, not much I can say about him that hasn't been said a million times before. The complete striker. I hope I'm right in assuming that Nemeth is coming back for the new season?. His season there was hampered by an injury in the New Year, and though he only managed 18 games, he scored 3 goals and had numerous assists. A previous winner of Reserve Team Player of The Year and Liverpool Young Player of The Year coupled with his loan spell in a very tough and hard League, I think he's ready for us. What the deal is with Jovanovic?, I don't know. From what I've read about him, many people on this forum seem to think he can do a great job for us, so I'll go with that. We also have the versatile Pacheco, who can play up front, in the hole or out wide.

      And last but not least, Steven Gerrard. He can play anywhere, on his day there is no better all round footballer on the planet in my eyes. In the middle, in the hole, on the left, on the right and even up front in a 4-4-2 if need be.

      Apologies if I've missed a player that others think is ready for the Squad, it's quite a condensed post and my mind is wandering with all the worry.

      So there you have it. One reason why I'm not so depressed at the moment. I'm pissed Rafa has gone, but he has. It's done. Whatever manager comes in, I just hope they are attack minded. We have the players here to do a job, the youngsters are good enough. I hope we get a manager who can relate to the players better on a psychological level, a manager who can nurture players, a manager who talks to his players, a manager who knows the players, a manager who can adapt his tactics to suit different opponents and a manager who doesn't underestimate his opponents. I feel that there are very few candidates who possess these required qualities.

      I'd love to see Kenny Dalglish back in the seat, but that's just me being over emotional. And as for those who say he's too outdated for the modern game?, what the f**k is all that bullshit!. Kenny Dalglish has all the attributes to be an outstanding manager, he has won trophies, he is probably the greatest player to ever wear the shirt ( and that is some statement when you take into account the legends that have put it on ). He knows the Liverpool Way inside out. His footballing brain is second to none, do people really think he's become rusty?, do people think he doesn't watch football anymore?, please, stop embarassing yourselves with such outlandish comments.

      He knows how to play incisive and effective football, he knows how to outguess his opponents, he knows how to train players and their minds, he oozes legend. Players will want to play for him, players will want to run through brick walls for him, his footballing knowledge will be applicable to any era, whether that be the 70's, 80's, 90's or 00's. To argue otherwise is futile. If he comes up against a team that are nullifying his tactics, do you really think he'd be incapable of adjusting the tactics and reading the game to counter his opponents?. That is just ridiculous. A genius is befitting of any era, as is the mind of a genius also.

      Kenny siad he'd never return to management, though you never know. I'm just arguing the point that he can be effective as a manager in the modern era, his brain is still ticking, it's still fresh, still full of ideas. He still watches games and analyses them inside his mind, he is football. I'm just saying that if he did take the job I'd be landed. I wouldn't mind seeing Sammy Lee in charge either, he is as passionate as anyone about the Club and I bet he is thinking he could get called into the office soon. Thommo, Roy Evans?, yeah, I'd be happy. Would I choose these four ahead of MON, Hodgson, Hughes, Jesus, Eriksson and Hiddink?. Too f**king right I would, those four know the Club, they breathe the Club, they are the Club.

      YNWA.
      « Last Edit: Jun 05, 2010 05:05:19 pm by hardcoresoldier, Reason: Put Spearing down as a sell buy mistake »
      hobbithead
      • Forum Emlyn Hughes
      • ****

      • 747 posts | -3 
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #36: Jun 05, 2010 05:04:38 pm
      Slightly off topic, but i had to do it.

      "Lucas Sidewalker"  :lmao:
      RedLFCBlood
      • Guest
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #37: Jun 05, 2010 05:11:14 pm
      Top post Hardcore and if there is one man amongst the lot that you mentioned that would give the youth a chance to shine, I believe it would be Evans, Evans also likes to play the game the Liverpool way as we seen during his Tenure, I'd love to go back to the old boot room philosophy I've said it since Rafa left.

      Give me a management/coaching set up of Thommo, Evans, Dalglish, Sammy and Rushie and give the club its identity back, I'd hate to see some no mark Hicks & Gillett yes man take over, that would just capitulate us.
      hardcoresoldier
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 5,160 posts | 1288 
      • The Liverpool Way is The Only Way
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #38: Jun 05, 2010 08:11:55 pm
      Top post Hardcore and if there is one man amongst the lot that you mentioned that would give the youth a chance to shine, I believe it would be Evans, Evans also likes to play the game the Liverpool way as we seen during his Tenure, I'd love to go back to the old boot room philosophy I've said it since Rafa left.

      Give me a management/coaching set up of Thommo, Evans, Dalglish, Sammy and Rushie and give the club its identity back, I'd hate to see some no mark Hicks & Gillett yes man take over, that would just capitulate us.

      Agree with what you're saying Blood. My only concern is that the owners would not want to implement the 'Boot Room' method. As you've said, primarily they'll set their sights on a 'Yes' man. None of the above would stand for their slimy ways.

      The way they have dealt with Rafa is disgusting and slimy, just a projection of themselves.
      Djimi Traore Legend
      • Forum Youth Player

      • 7 posts |
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #39: Jun 06, 2010 12:33:01 am
      I don't think Gerrard is a wise choice in CM for big games, his positional indiscipline can be a liability against quality attacking sides, which is why against Rags, Arse, Chavs, Spurds, Citeh Villa he is justified to opt for Lucas in the middle. Like it or not Lucas is sound positioning wise, and is consistent. Which is why we need an upgrade on Lucas for the formation to work again, someone like Banega or Martinez who can dictate a game
      RedLFCBlood
      • Guest
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #40: Jun 06, 2010 01:25:00 am
      Agree with what you're saying Blood. My only concern is that the owners would not want to implement the 'Boot Room' method. As you've said, primarily they'll set their sights on a 'Yes' man. None of the above would stand for their slimy ways.

      The way they have dealt with Rafa is disgusting and slimy, just a projection of themselves.

      Obviously mate they would not want that all but for me this is where Kenny can earn his salt, we all know the great man has a love for this club that surpasses the wages he recieves from H&G so in my opinion I think we may just see Kenny go against H&G and do whats best for LFC in the long run.
      Misty
      • Forum Legend - Fagan
      • *****

      • 2,586 posts | 62 
      • At the end of the storm- Is a golden sky....
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #41: Jun 06, 2010 02:44:45 pm
      OPTIMISM!
      Cumbria Red
      • Forum Alf Arrowsmith
      • *

      • 59 posts |
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #42: Jun 06, 2010 03:34:54 pm
      If the inevitable does happen and we lose Masch, Torres, Yossi, Kuyt and Gerrard I would love to see some of the extremely promising youth players drafted in. With one or two "Realistic" signings and look a little like this -

                                                  REINA (C)

             Johnson                   Agger          Wilson                 Carragher

                                               (Parker/Cattermole/Lucas)

             Amoo/Babel                                   Aquilani                          Rodriguez


                                                Jovanovic        Pacheco

      Manager - Roy Hodgson or Kenny Dalglish

      This is about as realistic as I can imagine us being next season, would also have Dalla Valle introduced in to the 1st team squad with Kelly/Irwin/Darby involved alot more.
      We are not going to be signing Silva, Cole, Milner I'm afraid to say. Reina a cert for the captaincy. Insua on the transfer list im afraid looked far too heavy last year, wish we still had Steven Warnock too.
      JD
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 39,683 posts | 6980 
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #43: Jun 06, 2010 03:39:42 pm
      Can see a similar post-apocalypse team as Cumbria Red above ^

      Although I'd have the Kyrgiakos with Agger at the back and Carragher would lose out to Insua at left back.
      kelvo
      • Forum Legend - Fagan
      • *****

      • 3,207 posts | 52 
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #44: Jun 06, 2010 04:08:55 pm
      I hope we revert to 4-4-2 with two "real" wingers for a start.

      On a side note, people talk about we need a partner for Torres..I think we have the perfect choice in Kuyt. We all know he has limited abilities but has good ability in the air and to hold the ball up using his strength, he would take some of the knocks that Nando has had to endure playing as a lone striker under Rafa and therefore hopefully we'll see him playing more games over a season.

      If we can keep the majority of them together we still have a very good team. Under the financial circumstances we could do worse than play Agger at left back and hopefully we'll see more of Pacheco, Amoo, Robinson and Kelly too.

      If Masch goes, which Im sure he will...forget about the likes of Toure and go for Scott Parker and I think Maxi will continue to impress.

      GERNS
      • Forum Legend - Paisley
      • *****

      • 12,387 posts | 1542 
      Re: May I dare a little optimism??
      Reply #45: Jun 06, 2010 04:23:07 pm
      4 1 3 2 for me with Masch holding. Lucas for his cover. Gj, Carr, Skrtel,Agger at the back
      SG C.M. Benni L.M Maxi  R.M. Aqua either in the hole or up top with Nando. I don't think that's a bad side with what we have on board. Still prob need some new options at L.B. L.M. and cover or partner  for Nando.  With no money for players, this is the best we can hope for. Still good enough for 4th before we are able to recruite.

      Quick Reply