Carragher's hoofing. Will it affect us this season?

Anyone that doesn't think giving away cheap possession and having our defensive line on the edge of our box isn't a problem then very hard to argue with them. Carragher will be a massive problem this season

I get the same frustration when Kuyt is out wide or manages to beat his man only to scuff the ball across the floor or hit the first man ...every time

but surely it would be easier for Carra to stop hoofing and find a short pass to someone, than for Kuyt to improve on his wing play... I see what your saying but, Kuyt not being the best crosser in the game is a flaw in his game, Carra hoofing the ball up the pitch is more of a tactic in his game... (I'm only talking about the times when he does it when he has other options) Hopefully this will improve when we have Gerrard back and when Adam has settled down more but it doesn't seem like lack of options is the only reason he does it.

IMO Carra hoofing will effect us, we loose possession most of the time when he does it. Getting the ball on the ground and passing it is a much more attractive and effective way for Liverpool FC to play.

but surely it would be easier for Carra to stop hoofing and find a short pass to someone, than for Kuyt to improve on his wing play... I see what your saying but, Kuyt not being the best crosser in the game is a flaw in his game, Carra hoofing the ball up the pitch is more of a tactic in his game... (I'm only talking about the times when he does it when he has other options) Hopefully this will improve when we have Gerrard back and when Adam has settled down more but it doesn't seem like lack of options is the only reason he does it.

IMO Carra hoofing will effect us, we loose possession most of the time when he does it. Getting the ball on the ground and passing it is a much more attractive and effective way for Liverpool FC to play.

Out of the 100's of passes in a game its probably 5 passes (or attempted ones ) that he fails with, im not fussed about it, he needs to keep the ball on the floor yes but i dont think on the overall result of the game it has any more effect than kuyt screwing up a cross, its just a crap pass, we should still bang 4 past sunderland ect.

but surely it would be easier for Carra to stop hoofing and find a short pass to someone, than for Kuyt to improve on his wing play... I see what your saying but, Kuyt not being the best crosser in the game is a flaw in his game, Carra hoofing the ball up the pitch is more of a tactic in his game...

At the same time, Carra's hoof is in no way a tactic, it's a hopeless hoof that generally 9 times out of 10 does not find a man. As for Kuyt he's a grafter and will always have a place on our team, he also provides important goals too.

At the same time, Carra's hoof is in no way a tactic, it's a hopeless hoof that generally 9 times out of 10 does not find a man. As for Kuyt he's a grafter and will always have a place on our team, he also provides important goals too.

It seems to be a tactic to get the ball up the field for Carra, not a good one no. I used the word tactic because its not exactly a flaw in his game because he can make a short pass, just chooses not to, so I don't see why he can't just stop doing it.

Kuyt would be in my starting 11 every week atm. 

just to note i wasnt having a go at kuyt, its just to point out that both players can make the same errors and they both have no effect on the final outcome of the game.

i too would have dirk in the team, and i too would have carra in the team, he is one of the best defenders in the league without a doubt in my mind.

Yep, Carra would be in my 11 too, hoof or no hoof. Would much rather it be no hoof though  

As for the "hoofing", it's about options. If the only one available to him is the long pass, then he'll hit it. If one of the four midfield players gives him a better one, he'll take it. Simple really.

Disagree mick.

There have been countless times where I've seen Carra ignore midfield players in space showing for the ball, Lucas in particular,  only to hoof it up the pitch.

Now I've already stated that the midfield players should take some of the blame for this by not being more aggressive and demanding the ball as if it was Gerrard looking for the pass instead of some of our other midfielders you could bet 9 times out of 10 Jamie would pass the ball to him.

It's a problem in Jamie's game which is detrimental to the team but a more dominant midfield could help to make it happen less often and to be fair to Lucas he did take and demand the ball more last season than he has in the past.

Now that Carroll is in the team, Carragher will probably hoof even more, he probably sees it as the easy way out when it actually most of the time gives the ball back to the opposisition, it doesn't half annoy me sometimes though when you need a goal and we start passing it around at the back gaining a bit of momentum and then he does it

Will it affect us this season?

Not if we sign Cahill

I do think his lack of pace therefore spreading of our entire team due to having to sit deeper compounds the problem of his hoofing. If he were trying to hit a longer ball from 20 yards further up the pitch and we'd condensed play there would be more chance of us latching on to the flick or second ball. One of the other problems is that even when he does find his man with a long ball he's totally isolated due to the fact the midfield are stationed on the halfway line if not sometimes further back and this above the hoofing is the reason I believe we should look to replace Carra. We surrender far too much of an advantage to cover one obvious flaw and this must change in my honest opinion, Carra as back up would be a great place to be with Skrtel probably getting quite annoyed after playing as much as he did last year.

As Tony Blair once said: "We need to be tough on hoofing, tough on the causes of hoofing."

Bigmick is right, we really do need to look at the causes; the reasons behind why the Hoofmaster General feels the need.

Midfield:

* As 'Luke and others have pointed out: We play a deep line in defence. I'm going to say that this can, to a huge degree, be attributed to Jamie's lack of speed. Play higher up the pitch and Jamie just doesn't have the speed to cover the break. Our central midfielders therefore, particularly in a two, have to cover a lot of ground to 'show' for the short pass. When playing against a three the two are easily picked up; meaning, often, that they don't have space and as Carra hasn't the ability to pick and accurate pass in tight spaces. Result - Hoof.

However the other truth of the matter (and we've all witnessed it) is that Jamie has and does hoof even when players are 'showing'.

Carroll:

* It has been written that Carroll's inclusion is the reason behind the hoof but... the fact is Jamie was hoofing, big time, even when Torres was here but as Witto points out; with Carroll, Jamie has even more reason (in his mind) to hoof. This past two season's, in particular have seen a disproportionate rise in Jamie's "long pass"... Which brings me back to our midfield...

When Alonso played alongside Masch in a three we always showed, we'd always an out - invariably Xabi. It is no coincidence, in my opinion, that we saw less of the hoof*/long pass* (* delete as preferred).
 
Lucas and Masch, in my opinion, were too similar in style, passing ability and positional play - the 'out' just wasn't there.
 
Under Hodgson, with two in the centre of midfield; the 'out' was never there.

Last week, still with two in the centre of midfield, Sunderland played three and pressed high in the second half against a two that tired (understandably) after chasing three players all over the park; the 'out' wasn't there.

In conclusion, (to my mind anyhow): Jamie hoofs  because: a) we play a deep line, b) he hasn't the ability to pick a short pass, where space is at a premium and c) two centre midfielders against three.

So, in my opinion, until we can play a higher line, (and or), play three in the centre; sadly we'll see the hoof on a regular basis. If playing a higher line means we sign someone quicker and have to drop Jamie; so be it. If, however, we don't drop him; we need to be playing a three - the space between defence and our forwards is just too hard for two players (any two) to cover for  90 minutes.